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DAM/image library functions still weak

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80 Kommentare

  • Marco Hyman
    I've about 48K images in my catalog. Biggest gripe is the almost 40 seconds it takes to launch Capture One and open the catalog. But unless I run into a "need to restart" issue I only have to wait once a day.

    Another DAM gripe is that Capture One ignores dates before 1970. I've reported that as a bug.
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  • Robert Farhi
    fatihayoglu wrote:
    tenmangu81 wrote:
    mattcohen wrote:

    let me ask you and the other ones who get off on shielding this company from the consequences of their actions: if all of these limitations are so well known, why doesn't C1 provide guidance on catalog size? don't put more than 10k pictures in a folder, we have a known limitation. they don't do this, they just keep requiring more and more computing power which they then squander.


    I have 22k+ images in my catalog, and I know people who have 70k images, without any issue. I can find an image within less than 5 seconds (4 seconds to display all of the thumbnails after having clicked on "All images", and 1 second to fulfil the filter request). It strongly depends on the computer configuration of your hardware/software.
    But I admit that C1's catalog is far from having the same level as the LR's one.


    Out of interest, what is your setup? Because my catalog with 35k images are not so fast.


    MacBook Pro 15" late 2013, i7 2.3 GHz, 512 GB, 16 GB RAM, Nvidia GeForce GT750M, running under Mojave.
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  • Robert Farhi
    marchyman wrote:

    Another DAM gripe is that Capture One ignores dates before 1970. I've reported that as a bug.


    This is well known, and very unpleasant. It is related with the Unix time, they say....
    Robert
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  • SFA
    marchyman wrote:
    I've about 48K images in my catalog. Biggest gripe is the almost 40 seconds it takes to launch Capture One and open the catalog. But unless I run into a "need to restart" issue I only have to wait once a day.



    40 seconds?

    Dreadful.
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  • BeO
    Top Commenter
    Interesting thread indeed.
    One or the other in this thread mentioned he would not submit a festure request or complaint. Others have provided a link for convenience, and that is good thing. I do understand ranting sometimes gives relief to frustration, but that's about it. Complaining about politics but not going to elections is not very clever.

    In the end, I am fairly sure, forum posts will be buried in the archieve, voting with your wallet will not be recognized or understood correctly, so in the end, your best chance is voting by filing a request, as only this has the chance to appear in statistics for prioritising their developing work. Don't expect them to count the unique forum users here or aboard and make statistics, requesting something via their official channels is your part of the relationship, really.

    So, spare your next post and invest your time in a respective request instead, even if you have done so in the past as they have changed their helpdesk system to my knowlegde.

    https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/requests/new

    Regards

    Edit: I replaced a bad mouth word in regards to not going to elections, as I noticed I was drawn into possibly being inpolite by reading some early postings, sorry.
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  • mattcohen
    I have 140k pictures in the catalog I use most. It is currently totally unusable. Launch takes between 2 and 4 minutes. Searching takes up to 10 minutes per picture because there is a beachball at every keystroke. This is a brand new 16" MBP maxed out, main files on a Thunderbolt 3 M2 SSD RAID. Every other app runs fine. Including the other apps I have referenced on that RAID.

    Yes, some people with more than a few files have had success. But that is clearly not the norm.

    To the point that posts here don't do anything, I just find that bizarre. First, don't tell me how to use my time. This is my living, and I pay like everyone else. I have useless software. I'll address that situation any way I please. I know for a fact that they do read these posts, though it is not their policy to respond to them. And despite their efforts to distance themselves, this is an important source of information and it's under their site.

    Recently I did a video call with their lead (i think) developer about what annoys/confuses me as a new user. None of this was news to him.

    We have software that fails at doing something some users need and everyone agrees is basic DAM functionality. And it's also clearly not using resources efficiently, and on Mac using old tech (Open CL/Metal). On top of this I have a 2 month old ticket that I'm only just now getting preliminary response on. Why would you feel ok telling people in this position anything at all?
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  • Ian Leslie
    mattcohen wrote:
    Recently I did a video call with their lead (i think) developer about what annoys/confuses me as a new user. None of this was news to him.


    Wow, how did you get that level of service?

    Did you get any impression that there was a plan or intention to create a plan to do anything about any of the issues you brought up that he already knew about?
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  • BeO
    Top Commenter
    Mattcohen,

    I admit I maybe subconciously adjusted my post to the overall tone that I felt was prevalent in this thread especially in the beginning, but it is not meant to be offensive. My goal is to encourage people, not a specific person here in this thread, to get in proper contact to P1, and not to discourage people from posting in the forum. I suggested, that was my goal at least, to take the time to submit a request, instead of the next post; and then post again and as much as you want, but time spent to submit a request is time spent well. My belief.
    Again, my wording might not have sounded right but bare with me as I am not a native speaker.

    I think that this forum will echo to P1 too, but all the requests from otherwise silent users, which do not speak up here in the forum, but via the request system will be counted (or at least can be, and I have no reason to believe that if they say the request will be forwarded to development that this is untrue). I actually requested a feature this way prior release of v20 and it was implemented, probably because many have requested it, but maybe also because it would habe been a regression in the new version otherwise. Anyway, not comparable as it was a small effort when compared to improving the DAM notably, but, and I know how software business works, the direct contact with the company is the most important channel. Internet discussions or complaints might reinforce this, but can't be quantified very well by P1.

    And maybe these silent users request something different and maybe even get it because it is the majority of requests. Everybody can choose, discussing in the public, requesting in silence, or both. Not requesting something one wishes for via the help system does not sound reasonable at all.

    I want to have a better performance too, and to be honest there are people here in the forum I like to help without any benefit for me personally, and there are times when I want to benefit personally, and this is an example, the more people submit a request, that is my believe at least, the sooner I get a better DAM. That's all. I am sorry if you felt offended, not my intention, calm down (if you like), do what's right for you, and enjoy your weekend.
    And maybe consider filing a request. 😉
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  • mattcohen
    IanL wrote:
    mattcohen wrote:
    Recently I did a video call with their lead (i think) developer about what annoys/confuses me as a new user. None of this was news to him.


    Wow, how did you get that level of service?

    Did you get any impression that there was a plan or intention to create a plan to do anything about any of the issues you brought up that he already knew about?


    It wasn’t service, they had asked for volunteers who were new users. Lol service, I have 2 month old tickets.
    I’ve been in Aperture until very recently when I got a new MBP and couldn’t continue. I answered questions and gave my impressions about how it helped and hindered my workflow. He was aware of the issue, in fact, more aware than some who defend the company here even. But nothing beyond that of course.

    I will say I did bring up how fast PM+ was on the same masters and we talked about different use cases that would require different approaches.
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    BeO wrote:
    ... to get in proper contact to P1...

    For correctness, please replace P1 or Phase One with Capture One (as the company) when addressing your concerns regarding Capture One (as the software).
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  • Marco Hyman
    tenmangu81 wrote:
    marchyman wrote:

    Another DAM gripe is that Capture One ignores dates before 1970. I've reported that as a bug.


    This is well known, and very unpleasant. It is related with the Unix time, they say....
    Robert


    Yes, they say that. They are wrong. macOS has no problem with dates before the Unix epoch. Neither does any of the eleventy seven other image editing and processing tools I've tried.
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  • BeO
    Top Commenter
    Paul_Steunebrink wrote:
    BeO wrote:
    ... to get in proper contact to P1...

    For correctness, please replace P1 or Phase One with Capture One (as the company) when addressing your concerns regarding Capture One (as the software).


    Maybe Phase One A/S?

    That's their latest press release Paul, and their website does not make it any clearer. Once their marketing department figured out how to clearly communicate this distinction you made I will consider it. I think that should be the least concern in a user forum, don't you think, unless this distinction is necessary to clarify that from company a we can expect quality a and from company b we can expect quality b.



    https://press.phaseone.com/pressreleases/phase-one-launches-capture-one-20-2949306

    Phase One launches Capture One 20

    Press release • Dec 04, 2019 13:00 CET

    ....

    Capture One is developed by Phase One A/S, the world’s leading manufacturer of medium format digital photography systems and imaging solutions for professional photographers, and cultural heritage and industrial solutions. Established in 1993, Phase One has pioneered the field of digital camera systems and imaging software, including multiple breakthroughs – from the world’s first 100MP camera systems to advanced imaging workflows in Capture One.

    By controlling all aspects of the medium format camera system supply chain, Phase One is uniquely positioned to help photographers and imaging experts everywhere stand out from the competition and realize their creative visions without compromise.

    Based in Copenhagen, Denmark, and with offices in New York, Tokyo, Cologne, Shanghai and Tel Aviv, Phase One is committed to delivering an unmatched level of service and support to every customer through this expert team of global partners.

    Phase One and Capture One are registered trademarks of Phase One A/S. All other brand or product names are trademarks or registered trademarks of their respective holders.


    Regards
    BeO
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  • mattcohen
    Paul_Steunebrink wrote:
    BeO wrote:
    ... to get in proper contact to P1...

    For correctness, please replace P1 or Phase One with Capture One (as the company) when addressing your concerns regarding Capture One (as the software).


    amazing. they can't even settle it amongst themselves, and you're out here settling it for them.
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  • BeO
    Top Commenter
    Matt,

    Have given it a second thought I believe it might rather be a deficiency of the new owner, the investment firm Axcel. From my experience such firms tend to control their assets ( the company they buy) quite firmly especially management, financials, PR, marketing, strategy, if they are good. They are of course responsible for any reoganisation of their assets. If they are doing this without a proper roadmap and change management in place, which I do not know, this would have a direct impact on their asset companies departments I have listed. But who knows what's behind the curtain...

    Let's see if they are the kind of company which invest new money for real growth or try to cut down cost and sqeeze out the most out of it, short-term. Nobody will ever tell us but I think we will see it with the next or next two major versions...

    Regards
    BeO
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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter
    BeO wrote:
    Let's see if they are the kind of company which invest new money for real growth or try to cut down cost and sqeeze out the most out of it, short-term. Nobody will ever tell us but I think we will see it with the next or next two major versions...

    The support situation points in the direction of the latter possibility.
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  • mattcohen
    BeO wrote:
    Matt,

    Have given it a second thought I believe it might rather be a deficiency of the new owner, the investment firm Axcel.


    I meant the sycophant insisting on using a name even the company can’t settle on. He’s here to help!
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  • Grant Hodgeon
    mattcohen wrote:
    BeO wrote:
    Matt,

    Have given it a second thought I believe it might rather be a deficiency of the new owner, the investment firm Axcel.


    I meant the sycophant insisting on using a name even the company can’t settle on. He’s here to help!


    There's an arbitrary desire in these corners to misdirect the current topic into a devolved semantic debate about the name of the omnipotent. Ignoring the fact that the holy one itself cannot make up its own mind on how to present itself publicly.

    After doing my own digging regarding the splits, umbrellas and holdings surrounding this/these/all companies Phase -- it's quite funny to see the odd individual throw this kind of cock-sure, off-topic comment around.
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  • Bud James

    I've been using C1P for about 3 years. My Lightroom catalog had about 150k images. This choked C1P on the import. I ended up having to split my LR catalog into several smaller C1P catalogs to keep the catalog under 20k images. C1P does not like large catalogs, period. I'm running a iMacPro with 64GB RAM, 2TB internal SSD and Thunderbolt 2 connected OWC Thunderblade 8TB SSD. The read/write speeds of the internal SSD averages 2,700-2,900 MB/S while the external SSD averages 2,100-2,300 MB/S. Even with this setup, C1P is sluggish once the catalog exceeds about 20k image.

    Regards, Bud James
    Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto

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  • Robert Farhi

    It depends upon what you mean by "sluggish". Mine is about 23k+, and I haven't any trouble, albeit my config is much weaker than yours.

    Robert

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    In case anyone's still following this thread. As this is still the most neglected part of Capture One, I'm making a summary of catalogue/DAM related improvement requests (here). Please leave comments if anything is missing.

     

     

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