Will Phase One survive?
I like Capture 4 and am ready to invest in Capture 4 Pro for tethered shooting etc.
I would like to know your thoughts on the market strength of the Capture 1/Phase 1 compnay as I want to invest in a RAW processing product that will be updated with camera profiles, as well as tech support for the long haul.
I know the RAW processor field is a crowded one with strong competition from Adobe Lightroom, Apple Aperture, and others. Will Phase 1 be around so I won't have to reinvest in another RAW processor? Your thoughts would be welcome.
Thanks,
Paul
I would like to know your thoughts on the market strength of the Capture 1/Phase 1 compnay as I want to invest in a RAW processing product that will be updated with camera profiles, as well as tech support for the long haul.
I know the RAW processor field is a crowded one with strong competition from Adobe Lightroom, Apple Aperture, and others. Will Phase 1 be around so I won't have to reinvest in another RAW processor? Your thoughts would be welcome.
Thanks,
Paul
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First I must say that version 4 was a big disapointment. But if we talk about version 3.x.x I can't consider Adobe Lightroom as competition. I'm not familiar with Apple Aperture so I won't comment on that.
As far as I know PhaseOne is pretty solid company and I would be very surprised to see them go down any time soon. Of course I can be wrong. With version 3.x.x the support has been outstanding but there has been problems getting the newest camera profiles. There are workarounds for these issues and I'm pretty sure PhaseOne will improve in this area.
As far as the best RAW-converter goes I think it depends on the individual using the software. Not all programs suit all users, you have to find the software that works best for you and stick with it as long as it's available. The history has shown that there isn't sure bets, company fusions happen. Usually good programs survive no matter who will continue the development.0 -
You might want to rephrase your question to whether Capture One will survive? IMO, Phase One will certainly survive because of its backs, but after the recent debacle with the "upgrade" to C4, I wonder about the software surviving as is. I also wonder if this is not a carefully planned move. I've seen other companies make very similar moves. The following scenario wouldn't surprise me at all - PO dumbs down CO (ie, Capture One 4) for the mass consumer user, then sells the software division to Microsoft for a bundle of money, then laughs all the way to the bank! It would retain the name C4 and be usable for it's backs, but would not be of the same quality as before.
Unfortunately, in the corporate world these days, money speaks far more loudly than quality or customer satisfaction.0 -
I wonder if it's started already... 😎
When considering the state of v4 as-is right now, there's a telling quote from the link above : “Professional photographers are always looking for ways to reduce the amount of time they spend in front of the computer,†said Henrik Håkonsson, CEO of Phase One. “At the same time, enthusiasts want professional-quality tools but don’t want to be bogged down with features and functions they won’t use."
(my emphasis added)
Say what? Since when does simply being a non-pro mean you want crippled software? To me that, explains the sudden widening of the gap between the two editions, when 3.77 LE/Pro is compared to 4 as we see it now, vs. the as of yet vaporware Pro edition.
Anyway, we're apparently whistling in the wind, as it were...0 -
The company will be around for sure however given Phase One's history of blatent disregard for feedback from their testers I would seriously question the wisdom of choosing them as a platform. I've been an enthusiastic (even evangelical at certain points) supporter of C1 but unfortunately with this company each subsequent release is worse.
I'm a registered Pro user but if V4 Pro is anything like V4 I'll probably be switching to Lightroom.
Lightroom was a good version one effort (FAR ahead of the debacle that was Aperture) BUT, it of course had some bugs, the color wasn't quite there, and it was slow... painfully slow. Out of frustration I recently downloaded a demo copy of 1.3 and over the past year there's definitely been improvements to the point where I can say that I could use this piece of software to make a living with. 1.3 is now at a point where I can process an entire wedding with it (which I just did) without going mental. Much to my surprise in terms of color the output quality was superior to that of v3.7.7. C1P377 still has some tricks up its sleeve, most notably it tends to hold detail better in the shadows at high ISOs and it seems to have a slight advantage with highlights but that may be because I'm still figuring out Lightroom. I also processed this wedding in C1P377 and ultimately I'm shipping the Lightroom develops to my client (who in this case happens to be a photographer). The Lightroom versions had better color and contrast, and required less Photoshop work in post to get everything where I wanted it to be. In most cases the files I'm getting straight out of LR are what I want (v377 required additional work in Photoshop in order to correct egregious yellow shifts in tungsten light with my 1DMkII (yeah... I suppose it's old by today's standards but the ROI has been great... I may retire it in May... haven't decided yet... would be nice to get a 5th season out of it). It just saves me the time of having to go into PS which is the whole point behind a decent RAW converter.
Now... I CAN'T STAND working with stupid sliders... drives me freakin' nuts but V4 doesn't hold any advantage there anymore because they've REMOVED that feature (keyboard command equivalents for EC, CC, WB, and tone) and since they have... as far as I'm concerned it's an open table. I'll be considering DPP, and Bibble as well. Too bad Adobe bought RAW Shooter. C1's US support went down the tubes when Michael Tapes left them. The only reason I checked out RAW Shooter was because that's where Michael went... I kinda followed him. RSE/P was the solid base for an absolutely fantastic converter. I just wish more of that interface made it over to Lightroom but it didn't.
So, if you haven't checked out Lightroom in the past year I'd suggest giving it another look. Adobe has made improvements.
Cheers, Joe0 -
Lightroom is indeed a formidable app, but you shouldn't overlook the fact that it is not just a RC like C1 or RSE, etc. - it is much more than that. Lots of C1 users just don't want all the features. Personally I love it, it is feature packed, has excellent quality output, etc. etc., and is fast (on a good spec PC) but for those who don't need the DAM, print and web features, why don't you just use ACR4? It's the same engine that LR uses. (For those of you who are unaware, ACR4 available in PS CS3 is a quantum leap away from ACR3 in CS2.)
Of course, you could stick with the excellent C1 v3 until your camera is no longer supported!0 -
[quote="imacken" wrote:
that LR/ACR ...
Lightroom is indeed a formidable app, but you shouldn't overlook ...
- has no input profiles (they have, but you can't use them as output)
- white balance is inconsistent (was in ACR3x and still is in ACR4x)
- exposure is not as accurate as in C1 (in C1 it's quite close to real f-stops; compared it in ACR3x but didn't compare in ACR4x again)
- there are just 4 poor output profiles (and me I don't need one of them)
- if you change output profile, the look of the image changes. So if you adjust for output in sRGB or AdobeRGB but want to do an additional output in ProPhotoRGB you have to start with adjustment again. In C1 you can output in different output profiles and only RGB-data are changing - not the look of the image - as C1 always does clean perceptual conversion (of course including Gamma and Whitepoint which is apparently not the case in ACR/LR - most obvious if you adjust for sRGB and then switch to ProPhotoRGB).
So... beside image quality (really improved in ACR/LR V4x but still with a slight advantage for C1 in dark tonal values) and "workflow" (in the sense of handling the files) there are (or could be) some more arguments for C1...
Best Regards.0 -
I have decided to give my $300 to Adobe because of the tepid support for P1ware and their egregious ideas of what pros want workflow wise. Life is too short to wait for "vaporware".
I was really swayed by the professional support for Lightroom. I spent the last days looking at very professionally constructed video tutorials on the Lightroom podcasts/websites, especially by George Jardine. Adobe seems to have really listened during the year-long beta phase.
Answers to forums were quickly addressed. I had a very professional and helpful attitude from Adobe phone support and online.
Oh, yeah, and I saved $200.0 -
Its a shame that Adobe wont offer a competative upgrade from Phase One to one of the Adobe products.....
Phase One is on its last legs as a software provider to the masses....
They are having problems keeping up with all of the available cameras that shoot RAW....
Why even bother with Phase One... sooner or later the company will disappoint you in your requirements to get the job done.........
not worth the hassle.....0 -
I'm not as concerned with their camera updates as I am with their illogical design concepts and the mistakes that survived the beta phase. I just had to remove about 4 gb of cache files from December, for example. I still can't use the curve tool properly.
I am transitioning to Lightroom because it works. It might work at the same speed as C4 but I save time in the long run because I don't have to clean files spread around the various directories, close menu bar so I can use curve tool, etc.
P.O'd(that's how you probaly feel).
P.O. Should be releasing new versions with each feature they correct. The amound of lost productivity requires this move.[quote="Dixter" wrote:
Its a shame that Adobe wont offer a competative upgrade from Phase One to one of the Adobe products.....
Phase One is on its last legs as a software provider to the masses....
They are having problems keeping up with all of the available cameras that shoot RAW....
Why even bother with Phase One... sooner or later the company will disappoint you in your requirements to get the job done.........
not worth the hassle.....0 -
So am I hearing that Lightroom supports the PhaseOne RAW file format? I'm going to look into that at Adobe's site now, but thought I would ask here also. 0 -
I am still waiting for Capture One 4 Professional, I tried the first version 4.0 and because this version is void of the old Quick Proofs, I have no use for it. I was very disapointed.
Version 4 while having some very, very nice controls, failed in my book when I opened up the proofing for web feature when it renumbered the images different from the origianl files. I loved the speed at which these images were processed though!
We are still using 3.7.7 as 3.7.8 will not process an image if it has been Trashed and then recovered from the Trash Bin.
I sincerely hope that Phase One will consider these issues!
Capture One is the one program that is hard to live without, Version 3 was so well thought out for the working portrait photographer, the shortcut keys and everything, I learned to love when sorting and prosessing 200+- per client are all very important to us.
I hope I am not sounding too discouraging, but PhaseOne is that important to us.
Bill Nieman0
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