Custom thumbnail order not sticky
Hi,
In the C1 browser, I can move thumbnails around by drag and drop as I want. But when I close C1 and relaunch, the order has been reset to the default sort order which makes this feature useless.
How can I make this custom order sticky? What option did I miss?
Thanks in advance.
In the C1 browser, I can move thumbnails around by drag and drop as I want. But when I close C1 and relaunch, the order has been reset to the default sort order which makes this feature useless.
How can I make this custom order sticky? What option did I miss?
Thanks in advance.
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More about this...
When one reorganizes the thumbnails by dragging, a warning message is issued about C1 switching to Manual sort mode. Once the message has been acknowledged, I can see that the sort order is now set to Manual.
However, when I relaunch C1, my custom sort is lost, the sort mode is still set to Manual but the actual order appears to be random and doesn't correspond to any of the available sort modes and, of course, not to my custom order set in the previous session.
So for me it's just another bug.0 -
Someone just told me that there's no problem on the Mac, so this must be Windows specific. 0 -
I just tried this on the Windows version of V9.0.3
I set the sort method for one folder to Manual and dragged one image in the Browser to a different position.
After restarting Capture One the folder was still set to Manual and the image was still in the position to which I had moved it.
I am using a catalog with referenced images.0 -
I think "Manual" sort order is maintained however it is easily possible to flip to a different sort order. (Sessions)
Of you reselect Manual mode when re-opening the browser the order seems to be maintained from last use (assuming you closed the window with the Manual sort order selected).
If the order is reset to something else try reverting to Manual again and the order you previously established should reappear.
If you have a Manual order set, then change to a different sort order default and from that point drag an image somewhere different to its sort position you should see a message to the effect that you already have a Manual sort order created (though not actually currently applied) and if you continue with this new repositioning on the currently selected sort order a NEW MANUAL sort order will be established replacing the old one.
This seems to be reasonable.
An established Sort order seems to retained IF the folder in use has been set as a session favourite. Not retained if it isn't.
Whilst it all seems a little random in several years of using C1 I can only recall using a manual order for any productive purpose once. So I would have to conclude that although it may be an interesting distraction to try to work out what the rules may be and whether they are reliably applied .... it matters not as far as my usage requirements are concerned.
Grant0 -
[quote="RichardT" wrote:
After restarting Capture One the folder was still set to Manual...
OK for me too.[quote="RichardT" wrote:
...and the image was still in the position to which I had moved it.
On my system the image positions are not retained. I get some kind of random order that doesn't correspond to any available sort order. I can't find any pattern.[quote="RichardT" wrote:
I am using a catalog with referenced images.
Me too.0 -
[quote="SFA" wrote:
If the order is reset to something else try reverting to Manual again and the order you previously established should reappear.
That works this way until I exit C1. The custom order is lost when I relaunch[quote="SFA" wrote:
If you have a Manual order set, then change to a different sort order default and from that point drag an image somewhere different to its sort position you should see a message to the effect that you already have a Manual sort order created (though not actually currently applied) and if you continue with this new repositioning on the currently selected sort order a NEW MANUAL sort order will be established replacing the old one.
Doesn't work that way for me. Assuming I'm in "Name sort" mode, when dragging a thumbnail, I get a warning message about the sort mode switch to Manual. If I change to Name sort and drag another thumbnail, there's no warning this time (I didn't disable any warning). The new move is taken into account when I switch between Name and Manual mode. No problem... until I exit C1 and relaunch.0 -
Anyone knowing where this custom sort order is stored? I couldn't find anything about it in the user.config file and a quick look at the SQLite database with an external tool didn't allow me to find any information about this either.
So I guess the information is not stored at all for some reason. That's probably why the manual sort order is not restored when relaunching C1.
Permissions on user.config are OK.0 -
I have tried with an album and there's no problem. Manual sort is not supposed to be sticky when used on folders? 0 -
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
Anyone knowing where this custom sort order is stored? I couldn't find anything about it in the user.config file and a quick look at the SQLite database with an external tool didn't allow me to find any information about this either.
table ZIMAGEINCOLLECTIONPROPERTIES ( Z_ENT, Z_PK, ZCOLLECTION , ZIMAGE , ZCOLLAPSED, ZMANUALSORTINDEX)0 -
[quote="BeO" wrote:
table ZIMAGEINCOLLECTIONPROPERTIES ( Z_ENT, Z_PK, ZCOLLECTION , ZIMAGE , ZCOLLAPSED, ZMANUALSORTINDEX)
Thanks BeO, I had missed it (it was already late).
Well, in ZIMAGEINCOLLECTIONPROPERTIES I can find the indexing for all collections but nothing related to a catalog folder appears to be listed here. So I guess that folders don't support manual order (in which case why allow me to drag and drop thumbnails in a folder) OR that it's a bug.0 -
[quote="SFA" wrote:
I can only recall using a manual order for any productive purpose once. So I would have to conclude that although it may be an interesting distraction to try to work out what the rules may be and whether they are reliably applied .... it matters not as far as my usage requirements are concerned.
I need manual order in numerous cases. Since C1 doesn't allow me (unless I missed something) to stack images like in Lightroom (a very practical feature), at least I'd like to be able to group similar images.0 -
Yes, maybe not for folders. But if you create an album for each folder maybe that's the trick. 0 -
I have been wondering why I got a different result to the OP, so I did some more experiments.
I have since discovered that the change that I reported above was a fluke! In that change I simply moved the last image in a folder in front of the previous 2 images. This new order was maintained after restarting Capture One. I have repeated this exact change several times and it is persistent. However, all other re-orderings that I have since tried in that folder and in other folders are not maintained!
One other thing I have noticed is that after selecting any of the entries in the Recent Imports list and manually re-ordering its images, that new order is consistently maintained after re-starting Capture One.
It seems strange that the re-ordering is maintained for Recent Import entries (which are ephemeral) and not for the actual folders themselves 😕
Richard0 -
Thanks Richard. [quote="RichardT" wrote:
However, all other re-orderings that I have since tried in that folder and in other folders are not maintained
Yes, I have also noticed similar behavior.[quote="RichardT" wrote:
It seems strange that the re-ordering is maintained for Recent Import entries (which are ephemeral) and not for the actual folders themselves 😕
Which refers to my statement above: it seems that only the moves made in collections are preserved. And sometimes these moves are partially reflected in the source folder(s) for the collection images.
Obviously there's something wrong with the management of the related table in the database (catalog). I have used an external tool to look at what is happening in the ZIMAGEINCOLLECTIONPROPERTIES table while using manual order in collections and folders and this appears to be rather inconsistent.
For me there's no doubt that it's a bug.0 -
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
For me there's no doubt that it's a bug.
Which you should report to P1 then, if not already done.
Cheers0 -
[quote="BeO" wrote:
Which you should report to P1 then, if not already done.
Done since last week.0 -
I got an answer from the support: this bug should be fixed in the next release. 0 -
Wow that's great. I don't use this feature actually - what I mean is that I never got an answer like that, the best was "yes very good idea" or "the bug has been reproduced and passed to the development".... what the heck did you do 😕 😊 😄 😂 0 -
[quote="BeO" wrote:
Wow that's great. I don't use this feature actually - what I mean is that I never got an answer like that, the best was "yes very good idea" or "the bug has been reproduced and passed to the development".... what the heck did you do 😕 😊 😄 😂
Reported one that has already been fixed?
Grant0 -
😉 😉 0 -
[quote="BeO" wrote:
what the heck did you do 😕
After they told me that I had access permission problems with my C1 files or that my database was possibly corrupted, I started to talk about what I was seeing in that SQLite database and how inconsistent it was. Obviously, this led them to do more testing and to acknowledge the problem.
This is not specific to PhaseOne but customer support teams usually have a defensive attitude when a bug is reported. They often try to show you that something is wrong with you or your system or your configuration instead of testing thoroughly the issue that you are reporting. Telling them you are a developer or a system engineer sometimes helps, though.
Anyway, let's see if this promise will be kept...0 -
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
They often try to show you that something is wrong with you or your system or your configuration
And this is often true (generally speaking for software), at least it must be eliminated from the equation.[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
support teams usually have a defensive attitude when a bug is reported.
Defensiveness is often proportional to work-load.[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
I started to talk about what I was seeing in that SQLite database and how inconsistent it was.
Like a metadata record for each local adjustment layer? 😉
Hopefully they are not too defensive, I don't want to risk that they encrypt the database in the future, as I was able to solve an issue in my catalog (with the locate function) via SQL; on the other hand I'd like to see improvements there and doubt support cases alone would trigger this, that's why I mention this...0 -
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
I got an answer from the support: this bug should be fixed in the next release.
Unfortunately, not fixed in version 9.1. Sigh!0 -
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
[quote="Samoreen" wrote:
I got an answer from the support: this bug should be fixed in the next release.
Unfortunately, not fixed in version 9.1. Sigh!
9.1 includes a huge number of fixed bugs, new functionality and camera/lens-support, unfortunately we cannot fix all bugs at once.0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
9.1 includes a huge number of fixed bugs, new functionality and camera/lens-support, unfortunately we cannot fix all bugs at once.
OK. So, please, don't tell me "this bug should be fixed in the next release" 😁 . Custom order in folders is not a minor function, I think. IMHO, this should be set higher in the priority list.0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
9.1 includes a huge number of fixed bugs, new functionality and camera/lens-support, unfortunately we cannot fix all bugs at once.
I'd also like to add this...
In the past, I have been running a software house and I have been a developer and a software consultant. So I know that there must be a priority list for all these bugs reports and suggestions sent by the users.
But I have also learned something else : my customers didn't care about my workload and my development resources. They paid for something and if that something didn't work as advertised, they wanted the problem to be fixed now. And the higher the price they paid, the quicker they wanted the problem to be fixed.
And C1 is not especially cheap... 😁 . Also, this is the first time that I upload so many problem reports about a software that I have been using only for a few months.0 -
Samoreen,
You said something very true, there is a priority order, as capacity is never endless.
The quicker you were able to serve customers the higher your costs (and the price for the customers) would have been.
And a priority list (as well as the issue backlog) is typically not published, and what's important for one customer does not need to be important for another. You should know this, given your CV.
Don't be too disappointed that your topics are not provided in 9.1. Enjoying what's been delivered is better for your mood.
Cheers,
BeO0
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