Capture One Express vs. ACR / Lightroom
I have to say that i am completely new to Capture One (CO) and know very little about it!
I have Capture One Express which was for short time available as free download - never really used it seriously because I did not like the interface. Well, I have decided to give it a chance and discovered 2 very interesting facts about RAW developed images. I used the same RAW file and developed it both in PS ACR and Capture One (CO)
1.Images from CO are sharper with more clear small details.
2.The area covered with CO is larger than ACR - to my astonishment it is like having a wider lens - in all four corners of the image there more details and objects that cannot be seen in ACR! - notice a red car on the right side and a blue boat on the left side - it looks like either from a wider lens or like another file!
See link -
https://picasaweb.google.com/1140156209 ... directlink
Any idea why?
I have Capture One Express which was for short time available as free download - never really used it seriously because I did not like the interface. Well, I have decided to give it a chance and discovered 2 very interesting facts about RAW developed images. I used the same RAW file and developed it both in PS ACR and Capture One (CO)
1.Images from CO are sharper with more clear small details.
2.The area covered with CO is larger than ACR - to my astonishment it is like having a wider lens - in all four corners of the image there more details and objects that cannot be seen in ACR! - notice a red car on the right side and a blue boat on the left side - it looks like either from a wider lens or like another file!
See link -
https://picasaweb.google.com/1140156209 ... directlink
Any idea why?
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It looks like Adobe is doing an automatic Lens Correction.
In regard to sharpness, this may just be the default sharpening which actually looks a little hight in the Capture One image but it is difficult to tell without the images at 100%.0 -
Hi drew,
Thanks for your answer.
How do you explain the fact that I do not have the same phenomena with Sony DSC R1 and Pentax K-10, but only with my Olympus E-PL1?
Anyway, I have checked both in Photoshop ACR and Lightroom and the Lens Correction option is turned OFF.
Still kind of a small mystery to me...0 -
It's a different camera and thus a different file, hence it will have different default adjustments applied to it.
In this case, it clearly shows some sort of lens correction applied. The best answer as to why ACR is applying this change will come from Adobe.0 -
Drew,
Please see the same post in DPreview web site
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readf ... e=411853610 -
Regardless of what is seen in Capture One, I would be interested to hear what Adobe says in regard to there interpretation of the RAW file. If they are adhering to some specific measure that Olympus requests then it would seem to be (from my perspective) to your disadvantage.
Out of curiosity, what is seen in the cameras screen when composing an image? If these parts are edited in the cameras screen, then there is no diservice or bug to you as a photographer but rather an advantage of a little extra "wiggle-room" when editing with other softwares.0 -
Drew,
Bare with me as I try to understand what you mean. I am what you can call an advanced amature - not professional. What I see on the screen is what I get as final result as a saved Jpeg image. The images I get from Capture One are "wider" than the images I get from Adobe.
I have tried to understand from Adobe web site how to contact them - but I was lost...the site is so huge that it is not understood how do you contact them...0 -
Drew,
I have spent a long time in Adobe web site and tried endless options of support. The site is huge, not so friendly and I was a bit lost in it. It either gives me an option of telephone conversation which is not relevant or contact as one of the followings - which I am NOT - just a normal photographer -
Adobe Gold and Platinum contract holders
Log in to the Customer Support Portal to create a support case, or see your contract Welcome letter for support contact information.
Omniture support
Log in to your Omniture product or visit the Omniture ClientCare portal.
CQ and CRX support
Visit the CQ and CRX Support Center.
Scene7 support
Visit the Client Resource Center.
Business Catalyst support
Log in to your Admin Console or visit the BC Support Center.
That's what I would call - not user friendly or customers oriented approach...0 -
Drew,
please see a comment to the same issue I had in a British Olympus users forum -
Micro-FourThirds raw files carry the lens correction parameters to raw converters that honor the appropriate intended processing. ACR and LR do, most others (CO) do not.
Any comment?0 -
This mentioned in connection with Olympus brought up some vague old memories from some years back. Something to do with Olympus cropping the edges of an image on the basis that the edges of the sensor might be the most obvious place to uncover quality problems - noyt unlike the very edge of a negative if one scans it.
Anyway, I Googled a quick search and it turned up a reference to something that may be of interest on the dpreview forum.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read. ... e=40791311
It sort of confirms my vague memory. You will need to read all of the posts in the thread (I think).
No idea if it is entirely accurate - sorry.
Grant Perkins0 -
In order to elaborate on the issue following some information I have collected from Luminous Landsacpe web site and Thomas Knoll, who is one of the original authors of Photoshop and the creator of Adobe Camera Raw.
" You may not realize it, but your digital camera does not give you every pixel that it records.
In most cases this is because the manufacturer masks off pixels at the very edges of the frame. This is done for a couple of technical reasons.
1. Many of the image processing algorithms (de-mosaicing, noise reduction, sharpening) that camera firmware (or raw conversion software) apply to raw sensor data are not "point operations", but instead "neighborhood operations". When computing the output value of that pixel, the algorithm needs to know not only the input value of that pixel, but also the input values of the pixels in the local neighborhood. The pixels at the very edge of the recorded image do not have a complete local neighborhood, so the algorithms need make some guess as to their value, which means that output results for these edge pixels will be not quite as accurate as the pixels a few pixels away from the edges. By trimming away these pixels, the camera manufacturers guarantee that all the output pixels are of maximum quality.
2. Sometimes image sensors do not have aspect ratios that exactly match the standard aspect ratios (3:2, 4:3, 16:9, etc.). In these cases, there are often different numbers of horizontal and vertical pixels hidden, to cause the final output image to have an exact ratio, When some users print digital camera images, they often do not bother to crop them, so having the camera output images with standard aspect ratios that exactly match standard paper dimensions is an advantage.
Solving this problem that few people knew even existed, Thomas Knoll, who is one of the original authors of Photoshop and the creator of Adobe Camera Raw, has written a free utility program which recovers all the pixels that any supported digital camera records, whether it's hidden edges or intentionally cropped formats. Called DNG Recover Edges, the utility application is unsupported, and it is not an Adobe product."
Another interesting comment came from a reader of my thread in DP Review web site forum:
" RAW images usually contain capture area of the entire sensor, while the intended viewing area is smaller. While capturing the image, both sets of dimensions are recorded with it. From what I have seen so far it is just a few pixels on each side, but your examples show quite substantial difference. The purpose of that is to simplify the conversion from RAW to Jpeg as the edges require different algorithms, as well as to discard the areas with the most quality issues (i.e. vignetting, CA, poor sharpness).
I've seen an utility that was making the full captured image available - simply by copying the tag describing the physical sensor dimensions into the image dimensions field, but I'm not sure if it would cover your camera's format. If I remember correctly it was working with .dng files only."0 -
Luminous Landscape - probably where I first read about it but I seem to recall another source that made specific mention of the Olympus approach for some reason.
Grant Perkins0 -
I explore more the Capture One Express - compare it to PS Adobe Camera RAW - Lightroom and find in almost all aspects to be superior, but facing a problem - when used with my Olympus E-PL1 camera images have a Convex lens effect (let me call it a light Fish Eye lens effect) where there is a horizon line or straight lines - the processed Jpeg image shows curved lines. In ACR the straight lines appear to be straight.
See samples here -
https://picasaweb.google.com/1140156209 ... directlink
https://plus.google.com/photos/11401562 ... banner=pwa
Again, this is CO Express so there is no lens correction option.
I DO NOT have this effect with images from my other camera, Sony DSC R1.
Any idea why this happens and how o correct it?0 -
This thread is somewhat dated. I did purchase Capture One Pro after comparing it to Lightroom4.
Some backgroun I am using Linux as my main operating system and there we have darktable which is really pretty good (and free), it is missing local adjustments but not much more.
Give the volume of pictures I have to process I was looking at improving my workflow. I run Capture one in a dedicated vmware with 8GB ram 2cpu with 2cores. It is amazing fast and the final output is so much better than darktable. It is not day and night but the difference between pretty good and WOW.
I really wanted to like lightroom, but it is slow, requires a lot of plugins to get close to capture one and is definitely slower.
Since time is money I did go with Capture One. I still use darktable extensively (I don't have to start the vmware for that) but when there are skins or architecture involved I work with Capture One0 -
[quote="realistgva" wrote:
I really wanted to like lightroom, but it is slow, requires a lot of plugins to get close to capture one and is definitely slower.
Just for clarity and balance, that might be true for you, but it's not a statement of general fact: I don't use a single plug-in in Lr and I get superb results, especially at higher ISOs, where Cap One simply can't compete...0 -
Keith,
I try to stay away from noise as much as possible. If I go above 400 or 800ISO it is really the exception.
That being said when I have a noise issue darktable on linux is choice. There are many noise reduction options.
There is also Corel with Noise ninja but so far I have not used the tool(other than for testing)
I know people get amazing results in LR but many I know will have Nik and onone plugin's to improve the process. I think you would at least need a plugin for the layers.
For my the only 2 reasons to actually pay for Capture One Pro over the pretty good free alternative on Linux
Where speed and quality of the output.
With capture one I get consistently better results and faster than the other tools. In many cases I may be splitting hairs. But any blind test compare the Capture one pro was picked over the other(either LR or more often Darktable)0 -
I most of the cases I find the Phase One Capture One Express to give better results than ACR - Lightroom, mainly with my Sony DSC R1 - CO let's the Zeiss T lend shine! 0 -
Rony
Same here. I have a Sony A850 with a Zeiss 135mm f1.8
These huge RAW files from Sony are a real test for these tool. My files are typically around 25MB each0
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