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New prices! Are they for real? Perpetual scam!

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56 comments

  • Shane Baker

    Pierre
    C1 is now owned by a private equity company. Maximising profit in the short term will be their only interest.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    I agree Shane, that is the sole reason such companies even exist, and there is nothing in the business practice we have seen here which would indicate that this owner is any different from the others. That includes the typical sales/marketing buzz which we see.

    If at least they would go the extra mile and make new features as perfect as it could be (instead of following a typical 80/20 rule (80% of a feature can be implemented in 20% of the effort) and if they cared more about software quality (instead of breaking existing functions so often) then the new prices could be a win-win situation also for the customers.

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  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    BeO - This current owner has substantially raised prices.  Not only did they remove the brand-specific versions that were sold at a discount (I used the Nikon version), but they also substantially raised prices for a perpetual license and restricted upgrades.  This product is now a lot more expensive to own and upgrade than it was only 2 years ago.

    For reference, a Capture One subscription or buying a new perpetual license each year at the full retail cost now costs substantially more than the $9.99/mo Adobe Photography Plan that even includes Photoshop.  So, the new owners have substantially jacked up the price of using Capture One.

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  • David Mantripp

    With the current 30% discount, loyalty bonus and extra 10% offer, I just got a 65% discount on annual subscription. That doesn’t seem so bad…. Sure there’s no guarantee for the future, but for the present I’ll take it.

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  • Greg Theulings

    I am thinking to vote with my wallet and leave Capture One for Photoshop/Lightroom subscription.
    Not only you get Photoshop, Lightroom Classic and Lightroom CC (including mobile/ipad use) for less per month. It is also that Adobe surpassed Capture One in its feature set for Lightroom. The only reason to stay is for the tethering options. 

    So I am thinking to start to phase out Capture One. I am not in a hurry as CO perpetual license of course keeps on working. This is why I prefer perpetual licences over the subscription model. However I have more faith in Adobe's AI capabilities and implementations than I have with Capture One.

    I am still in good hopes that Serif (better known as Affinity) once will come up with a specific RAW editor, that would allow us to have one creative suite without having to think about subscriptions at all.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    Do you mean a catalog for raw files incl. editor? Affinity Photo has a raw developer, though I don't like it too much.

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  • Greg Theulings

    I agree, this is why I am still in good faith that Affinity will come up with a stand alone RAW editor solution that has its 'problems' fixed and will have a feature set that you may expect from a descent RAW editor. They indeed are not there yet. But as with their other software, they have shown to be very capable and competitive against Adobe.

    At this moment in time there is a huge opportunity for them now CO has shown they are incapable of keeping their user base.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    CO has shown they are incapable of keeping their user base.

    I am on the verge, and some left, but that does not mean their user base, it you count new users, actually shrunk. I guess you don't know where to see actual numbers, I would be interested.

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  • AllMediaLab

     

    The only reason to stay is for the tethering options. 

    No reason to do so!

    https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/kb/tethered-camera-support.html 

     

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    So the company can be expected to be sold before it's run into the ground completely?

    I'd have no issues with the higher prices, nor necessarily with the subscription model, if the change came with improved software quality and reliability rather than not quite finished features and insufficient resources for fixing the many issues and limitations of Capture One.

    I'll most likely stay on for now though as I don't know what else to use. I'm reluctant to go back to Lightroom, tried PhotoLab but didn't like its cluttered, unintuitive interface. And Photomator is nowhere near being a viable replacement.

    David Mantripp Any idea how long the 30% discount offer lasts?

     

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  • David Mantripp

    Nope.  Maybe ask CaptureOne ? :-)

    If you want to know what's coming down the pipeline, it's pretty easy: sign up to the Beta program.

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  • Greg Theulings

    Yes - The problem is Capture One doesn't tell you what features will be new and if the HDR and Panorama function would have been correctly implemented I might have had more faith. However the many problems these 'new' features have are still not resolved. This already has made me use 3rd party software to do these tasks. So basically I have been paying for 'new features' that have had a lousy implementation in the first place. As if they were rushed to be finished, to then not have updated them to get them working as they should.

    I am afraid that any new AI implementation into CO will be done as bad. So before spending another 200 euros for an update. I first want to know what features will be new, and how good they will be working. Then I also expect more than just 'bugfixes'. for those €200,- Euros.  Adobe's Photographers licence only cost 130 euros yearly and does give you Photoshop, Lightroom classic and the ability to use Lightroom on your iPad for those moments you are not having your laptop with you. In the end thats just a much better deal than paying 200 euro's for bugfixes without new feature implementations.

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    David Mantripp

    Thanks for your reply.

    I'm on the beta program, but it only gives you an indication of imminent changes, not of what's going to happen over the next the year.

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  • David Mantripp

    well ok, but which software company gives you a roadmap over a year?  They probably don't even know for sure themselves.  Let's be reasonable here.

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    David Mantripp

    I'm not requesting a roadmap. My complaints here are about the quality of the software, the lack of resources for fixing obvious issues and limitations, the not quite finished state of new features. As mentioned above, I'd be OK with higher prices, subscription too, if this was accompanied by improvements beyond what you'd expect anyway.

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  • jose fuj usoz

    After much consideration, I'm going back to Adobe, where I escaped from when I discovered the original Capture One. After years of enjoying these editions of CO, many many years, I leave it with regret, but the plans that Capture One has been proposing make it for me an even more unfriendly company than Adobe.
    I repeat, for me CO is a much better program (for my needs) than Photoshop or Lightroom, but I no longer go for these new proposals.
    I will continue to read all these developments just out of curiosity on the forums.
    Best regards to all,

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  • David Mantripp

    Given the relative proportion of software costs (even C1 full price) to all other photo gear, I am somewhat astounded that some choose to go for a solution which meets their needs LESS just to save a few coins....  

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    It's not as though Capture One doesn't have its disadvantages; the new licensing model is just one of them. Just as going back to Lightroom is a compromise, so is sticking with Capture One.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    Just as going back to Lightroom is a compromise, so is sticking with Capture One

    • Tendency for regression defects, with virtually every release, I am not really able to use any release beyond 15.2
    • Very bad bug fix policy for perpetual license customers 
    • Not sufficient fine tuning for new features
    • Lack of resources for fixing issues and limitations, the addon modules and new functions seem to be favored over the core product quality
    • Lost appreciation for their perpetual license customer base
    • Consequently, uncertainty how long the perpetual license model will be offered
    • Price is also a point. If you don't change or upgrade your photo gear too often there is a point where software to hardware cost ratio is becoming an issue, and taking into account what new features are actually worth for you (which of course is very user-dependent)

     

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    Another thing is, with Capture One you will need additional software to make up for its limitations (inability to handle large catalogues, edit GPS metadata, etc.).

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  • Markus Stamm

    Thomas Kyhn Out of curiosity: what do you call "large catalogues"? I have no issues regarding performance with several libraries I would call "large", meaning some tens of thousands RAW images each.

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    In my experience Capture One becomes unresponsive when performing insignificant tasks such as switching between tool tabs already with 20k+ images in a catalogue. The unresponsiveness doesn't last that long with a catalogue of this size, but as more images are added it only gets worse. With a previous catalogue containing 65k+ images (now split up into several smaller catalogues), Capture One was hopelessly slow, sometimes unresponsive for more than a minute when performing the same insignificant tasks.

    I've seen this across different versions of Capture One, different versions of macOS, etc. I've tried all I could think of, and I've been in contact with support about it for a long time, and their conclusion was that Capture One wasn't optimized for handling large catalogues and the only thing to do was to split up such catalogues into smaller catalogues.

    See this thread. And this request.

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  • Markus Stamm

    Thanks... that's odd, however. I honestly never experienced any similar issues with my libraries, the largest being around 80+ images. I'm on Apple Silicon, too, a M1 Macbook Air, so definitely lower specs than the machine you're using. The only time I see the spinning wheel occasionally is when the machine runs out of memory in general because of too many open apps, but then of course it affects all running apps. And I also made it a habit to give C1 some time to create all previews after an import.

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  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    Yes, my impression is that it isn't all users who experience this sort of unresponsiveness. Unresponsiveness when searching, for instance, is probably more of a general issue though.

    I still have no idea what's causing it. Not a word from support about it. And improvements in this area appear to have no priority, most likely because it would require that the catalogue system be rebuilt completely.

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  • Shane Baker

    Thomas Kyhn

    Yes, my impression is that it isn't all users who experience this sort of unresponsiveness. Unresponsiveness when searching, for instance, is probably more of a general issue though.

    I still have no idea what's causing it. Not a word from support about it. And improvements in this area appear to have no priority, most likely because it would require that the catalogue system be rebuilt completely.

    I have my collection in C1 divided into a number of catalogues to help speed (a little). LR OTOH, handles them all (~70k images).

    I've been concerned that this seemed to have zero priority at C1 for as long as I used it. However, it's now not an issue! 😏

     

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  • Greg Theulings

    ..... And then, just a few minutes ago, you receive an e-mail stating you get an extra 40% off when you upgrade to the upcoming version of CO Pro.

    That - to me looks as if they are desperate and tells me things are not going very well in terms of pre-orders or sales.

    Sorry, but it has all been too little too late.
    I am back to LR as I was still working with Photoshop anyway and for the money CO asks as in a monthly fee. It just doesn't offer me what Adobe does. I wonder, how long before CO needs to sell off all its assets to another software publisher. Here Serif comes to mind, who would have a great start with CO in their product portfolio.

     

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