New Feature Release 16.4 -> Money, money, money ...
The release of 16.3 was at the end of October 2023. Mid-May 24, half a year later another pay version 16.4 :(((
@CaptureOne: your management has learned nothing in the last year. Money, money, money ... but for what???
I have just extended my Adobe subscription for Lightroom/Photoshop by 5 years. At a price that CaptureOne wants to charge for the perpetual licenses for 16.3 and 16.4 in one year.
CaptureOne was my software of choice for many years. That is now history for me.
Goodbye
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Very funny answer. The LR/PS subscription including the mobile app costs me €8 a month. A lot of program for little money. How much does a CaptureOne subscription cost? 2 ... 3 times as much. Any questions?
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EM - it's well known that the Capture One subscription is more expensive than the Lightroom one. And the Capture One perpetual licence is also more expensive over time than a Lightroom subscription would be, assuming you choose to buy a new perpetual licence every time there's a new version.
As @... says, this has been the known state of affairs for some time now. So if you decide that you prefer Capture One to Lightroom, then you have to decide what the most cost-effective way to do that is for you. Or you can use Lightroom, if the cost issue sways it for you. Lightroom obviously a great program, and many photographers like it, though for myself, I don't get on well with it and much prefer Capture One.
Ian
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I choose Capture One for its quality and I find it worth the increased price over Adobe. We each have to make our own decision.
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CaptureOne is way better and faster than LR. No match in my opinion.
However, paying 200€ (for an upgrade to 16.4 perpetual licence) for one new feature (Crop AI) and one updated feature (GPU accelerated AI Mask) is quite hard.
First time ever, I will not update at that price.
I am waiting for other stuffs like Pick All Fix, batch HDR, GPU accelerated HDR, general stability improvements. However, C1's customers look to be more in studio. So the company cares less about event/architecture stuff.
Wait and see how it will go
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Walter Rowe the price for perpetual licence upgrade just doubled for a very mild update.
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yes C1 pro more expensive but
C1 pro is the best for studio and tethering
LR tethering is sucks
LR interface is sucks
I have no choice .0 -
Yes. But doubling the price is a bit hard...
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I've actually been a big fan of Capture One for years, but now I think it's getting too much. I didn't mind the subscription model and I understand that the costs have to be covered. If you don't always need the latest features you can choose the alternative license. With the introduction it was also said that the functions will be continuously expanded and new functions will be added. Now I have an All in One Pro license and the new functions are packed into a new application called CO Studio. From my point of view, we have now financed the development of a new application without benefiting from the new features ourselves. It's a shame, but I'm getting closer and closer to saying goodbye.
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I choose the subscription for C1. With the loyalty program I can now off-ramp to a perpetual license for free if I choose.
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Actually, I think it's ok/good they release new extended versions for specific needs.
Studio is also more expensive.
However, I dislike the fact to pay more for less.
However, CaptureOne is still the best photo software around. The new pricing looks totally like they are doing an Adobe...
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I'm a long time Capture One Pro user, the worrying thing about this update and the precedent it sets for future updates.
I understand the requirements for a 'Studio' version but to not give the fuller functioning AI crop tool to both versions is a really strange decision.
'Pro' no longer means 'Pro'. I understand about collaborative features but not a tool like this?
I hope this is rectified and isn't the start of a two-tier system!
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I misread the C1 promo about 16.4, and thought it claimed general GPU acceleration, but it only applies to AI masking, which on my Mac Studio is rather fast for my use. I was disappointed. Until a big improvement is released, 16.3 works for me and I see no reason to upgrade my perpetual license, yet. The improvements in 16.4 will not be of substantial use to me, and so I will upgrade when enough improvements tempt me more. I do not see this as a big deal. It is not as if a breakthrough in C1's capabilities is going to hugely impact what I do with C1 already.
If you do high volume commercial photography, there are gradual improvements that could benefit your bottom line more than the cost of an upgrade. Wait until the cost:benefit ratio of an upgrade is favorable.
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I see some people are confused. Pro and Studio both have AI Crop. In Pro it is automated(mode selection), in studio you can use auto, subject, face modes and in general have more control with some more options. I tested it extensively and for 90% of users I doubt extra controls from Studio would be substantially useful. I even used some product shots to test if some effects can’t be replicated by auto crop in Pro and I can say that I never felt auto AI crop was insufficient. Mode detection and crop ratio replication and placement in the frame as in reference photo was to my eyes just perfect.
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Capture One Enterprise
https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/articles/360002671937-About-Capture-One-EnterpriseCapture One Studio
https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/articles/17932082795037-About-Capture-One-Studio0 -
Oh boy, here we go again
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Yes here we go again.
Adobe and the other software developers must rub their hands together each time Capture One brings out a new version.
The same people winging about the same things on this forum each time and making things worse.
This forum is so toxic compared with any other forum.
Adobe Photoshop/Lightroom are just streets ahead of what they offer for the price and no bugs.0 -
This Pro edition minor release feature set is a joke. And still they don't fix all regression defects even if reported by a customer. Do they really think such a customer relationship attitude coupled with a bad value proposition for the upgrade is going to tease me upgrading? I am very dissappointed, but if I had a subscription, I would be p***ed.
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There is a table with features for each version there:
https://www.captureone.com/en/pricing/capture-one-pro
Basically, Studio offers better AI Crop and more collaboration possibilities. If
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I am on a subscription to be renewed in a couple of days. What worries me most with the announcement of C1 Studio is the fact that limited engineering resources now have to support another variant of Capture One. As I would assume that C1 Studio has the highest margin amongst different C1 product the company naturally will direct it’s resources there leaving C1 Pro with even bigger issues in terms of catching up with (e.g.) Adobe. I am really not sure if I should renew my subscription even though I like C1 very much and dislike LR/PS even more. Maybe I can get used to Adobes tools if I try really hard …
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From the pure economics point of view, whether or not there is a high margin I don't know, but a high margin doesn't do much for you without a high volume of sales. If only a very small number of customers go for the high-margin product, there is still more revenue to be earned from the lower margin but higher volume one.
Ian
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Every time there is an upgrade, the same comments are made. Users continue to like C1 and use C1 and generally prefer it, but complain about its shortcomings and there are many, just like with other products. What proportion of users (and I am thinking mostly of perpetual licensees), really are going to bolt from something that has been working for them, with all its limitations, and go to another software with all of that products limitations, different workflow, etc? Before actually leaving C1 for something else, is the move really going to improve your workflow, processing power, profitability, or ease of use?
I have a lot of frustrations with C1's laggardly approach to code efficiency, connectivity, database management, cost:benefit ratio of upgrades, but the central requirements for processing my photos is better than most and my need to upgrade is never urgent because I have adapted to C1's idiosyncrasies. If I were stuck with version 16.3 for years, I would not be hampered.
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Pro version, Studio version... I am anticipating a "Studio Pro" version in the future, where most of the development effort is going to be spent, partly trickling down to the Studio and Pro versions. :-)
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This is how consistent marketing works! Serve a few goodies drop by drop to keep the crowd in a good mood. We've known this for a long time and yet we're always indignant when things don't go according to our expectations. What remains is the fact of switching from champagne to sparkling wine and the gentlemen in Denmark know that. Personally, I'm always on the verge of switching after a release because I'm annoyed by the fact that some new features are being adapted that the majority of users probably don't need.For example, where is AI-supported noise reduction? In general, it makes sense to divide the software according to key functions and should be tailored to user-specific requirements. From the programmer's point of view, it is easy to put modular software together so that the end product takes on a different appearance. So what's the matter?
Strategy and marketing - this department has to make money at the expense of the users. But no one ask they what they really want.0 -
Oh boy, I did not mean to create an avalanche of comments. Still, I stand by my point that - with limited engineering resources - there will be an ongoing discussion about whom to prioritize, Studio customers or Pro customers. Asking a significant premium for the Studio version needs development of functionality and features, without giving these away to Pro customers. Whichever way I turn it, with limited resources there will be a resource shift from Pro to Studio. Many C1 customers (me included) have asked for AI noise reduction, a feature which most likely will not be important for Studio users (I am not a studio photographer), and which is available in Lightroom for a fraction of the price. I love C1, for my needs it is more powerful and efficient than Lightroom, and I love the user interface. But then there is cost, the absence of some important functionality and now - potentially - an internal competition about engineering resources.I do not have any insight in C1 as an operation, I just see parallels with other businesses I do know very well.
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I have the bug, that C1 does not show the last selected image after launching the software. The support told me the devs are working on a patch. After release of the 16.4 I asked again if there will be a patch to 16.3.x. The answer was that they don't know yet. Hope they will bring a patch for the 16.3.x. I don't want to buy a new license (and also not subscribe) just for a patch.
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For what it's worth, I personally don't know any working professional (in my circle) that ever uses a 'current' version of C1. New releases are notoriously buggy and when on set you cannot afford software failures. If you prefer to use C1, the way to go is buy a perpetual license and work one version behind. Save your money and update when there is a feature that significantly improves your workflow and a few .x.x (or whatever they call it now) bug updates have been released.
This whole enterprise (pun intended) of multiple feature releases a year is meant to be like holding a shiny object to a baby to entice you into a subscription. The problem is, they rush out the releases and more often than not, the resulting bugs are more problematic than the usefulness of the new feature. Stay on your perpetual license and until you need to update.
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I have been a C1 user for many years and I don't like LR at all. But for me, the new features in version 16.4 are completely unimportant. It would have been fair to the other users to offer all 16.x versions free of charge for active users and only charge an update price again from version 17 (with good, new features).
Most other software providers do it this way.
Do you need the money? Don't you sell any more cameras?
Is the pressure from Fuji, Leica and Hasselblad too great?
Take an example from Blackmagic Davinci Resolve. One perpetual purchase and all future versions included!
Too much greed for money will lead to you having to close down sooner or later!2 -
I agree.
However CaptureOne does not make any hardware.
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Capture One is not adhering to the major version numbering scheme of the past. You could imaging 16.3 as version 17, and 16.4 as version 18, but they aren't numbering versions the same way now. Rather than getting all version 16 updates for free, you are now getting all 16.3.x updates when you purchase 16.3, or all 16.4.x updates when you purchase 16.4.
Black Magic Design is a completely model. They make cameras and hardware for production studios and make most of their revenue from that. This affords them the ability to offer their software at a very competitive price with lifetime upgrades.
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But if the new features in version 16.4 are unimportant to you, you are free not to take that particular update, and therefore pay nothing.
Ian
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