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Copy Art

Martin A. Lavallee
HI, sorry this might be a bit long.
I have been a Phase One user for many years with a H20 back, over the last year I have started to do Copy Art for some of my portrait clients. I have just picked up a new to me phase one Df body and a P40+ back. I have read a few thing on the forum about copy art and have purchased the in camera software and polarizing filters for my lights. I also have bought some strip boxes for lighting also. After making my icc profile and copying the art and applying the profile and adjusting the exposure in PS and having to up the saturation about +15 the work has a gray look to it. Ok I admit I'm new at this but I have been in this business for over 35 year and have printed my own work both in BW and Color for many years.

I would like to hear from those that have done this what I might be missing so as to not have to make so many adjustment and more than 3 test prints to get a match or close to or slightly better looking print. I imprinting this on a Epson 9800 using image print and paper profile. I am on mac in PS CS6 with color calibrated monitor and soft proofing with the same profile for the paper.
Not sure what I misssed so any help would be great.
Thank you
Martin
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Comments

19 comments

Date Votes
  • Grant Kernan
    How are you making your ICC profile? I make my profile in a 3rd party software. These profiles are very exposure dependant and need to be perfect at exposure.
    My steps:
    My steps are fairly straight forward, and I should add that I don’t skip any of these steps.
    a) I set up my lights and roughly compose and focus my camera - fairly tight to the artwork.
    b) I "zig-align" my camera to the copy board.
    c) I shift the art work to centre it in my frame and refocus 25% in from an edge - not in the middle.
    d) I pre-scan the whole art work with the SG card laying on top. I put the SG card close to the leading edge where my light will be brightest…especially when lighting for texture.
    e) Then I balance the camera in Capture One using the middle grey patches. I adjust the exposure to obtain 243 RGB values in the SG white patch.
    f) I make 3 scans at 100%. I shoot the whole art with the SG card laying on top, then a scan without the SG card and finally an image of a clean flat oversized white card.
    h) I use the white card image to Equalize both images…the one with the SG card - and the painting image…both in Capture One using the LCC feature.
    i) Now I can make a better colour profile using Pictocolor’s "In Camera†software…The reason I don’t put the card along the edge outside of the painting is that I want the SG card to receive the same light as the painting…I want the SG card to receive the same exposure and equalight conditioning before I crop, save the file and use it to make the colour profile.
    j) Also I can modify my profile in Pictocolor’s "Edit Lab". Usually this requires a bump up in contrast, however if I am printing on matte canvas and then coating with gloss that process will also bump up both contrast and saturation.

    This is usually all I need to do. If my colour needs a small adjustment I can make an adjustment layer but it takes no more than two or three tests.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Hi Grant,

    Thank you for your reply and notes . I will try this for sure. I'm sure I will be writing again.
    Thanks you

    Martin
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  • Grant Kernan
    I should add that in order to remove Capture One's [ICC colour and tone flavour] output your image with Embed Colour Profile checked. This is because you will be removing Capture One's profile before you create your new Profile. After you create your new profile in "In Camera" - which is a PS plugin, you will be able to import the profile in Capture One.

    Almost all digital camera venders create pleasing colour profiles which are not appropriate for art copy. These usually have ramped up contrast and more than likely some sort of colour bias or colour cast. When contrast is ramped up subtle tones are lost in both highlights and shadows. Once the new ICC profile is applied, detail appears almost magically.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Thank you for that bit of info...

    Martin
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    HI Grant,
    This is weird. I upgraded to 10.2 today and did my copy work processed the images at 16bit generic RGB, when they came into Bridge i saw the image for 2 seconds and then they went black, any ideas?

    Thanks
    Martin
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  • Karl N
    Is InCamera Plugin working in new versions of Photoshop?
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  • Grant Kernan
    I would bet that PS doesn't recognize the Generic RGB profile that you chose. Try embedding Adobe RGB 1998.
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  • Grant Kernan
    In Camera only works within an 8 bit environment.
    Alfa Plugin's "Launch Box'" will open "In Camera" in the newer 64 bit CS6, however only 8 bit files are supported.

    http://www.alphaplugins.com/products/pr ... prod_id=19

    The workaround is to build a colour profile in 8 bit. Close Capture One. Open it. Then assign your new profile to your 16 bit
    image file. If you are happy with the custom profile use it but convert to Adobe RGB1998, either in Cap One at the output stage or later in PS.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Grant you are wight, not sure why I choose it, brain cramp. But learned that 10.11.6 has a bug and in processing I had to change in options had to choose a larger tile demotion. But all is well.
    Now to create the profile in PictoColor/inCamera.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    This is little off topic so I hope I can post it here. I am new to this field of copy art. I have been dealing with a client that brought me a canvas piece that she painted then lacquered on her back porch that to the eye you see some dust and is sticky to the touch. When I photographed it with dual polarization on light and lens the amount of dust that is in the print is crazy.

    Not having felt with painting on black it's looks like crap. I quoted her about 15 min ( dum on my part) and now I have about 1 hr or so into it. I texted her to explain that it would be more money for more time and she said I should have told her about the dust and brushed it off before I copied it. Well thats not going to happen It's indebted in the lacquer.

    Anyway does anyone have a a policy that they would share about copying lacquered pieces? Also I know from doing my own retouching that dust and scratch can hide some but it also degrades the image quality.

    Sorry for the long post but would like some imput if possible.

    Thanks
    Martin
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  • Grant Kernan
    Offer that you print it the way it was presented to you OR fix for more $ pius...
    Show the artist a sample...
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Thanks Grant...
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  • Grant Kernan
    Most of the time the image on the monitor will show a lot more detail than the actual print [unless the image is printed much larger]...so at 1-1 the image will print much like the original - and only the worst dust will show, but at 2X , 3X , or 4X the original size is where the dust will look really nasty.

    It is tempting to get carried away at both your's and the artist's expense and Much more difficult to be restrained and attack just the larger bits - remember this is not a glamour portrait where blemishes are the enemy.
    If the image is to be used only as a small art-repro then it will most likely not show at all, so I would explain that at larger sizes more work would need to be done.

    On a technical note;
    cross polarizing is a bit fiddly and slightly difficult, because both lights need to have there independent filters at the same exact axis. Even one filter at a slight different angle will start to introduce spectral highlights.

    I have switched from strobes to 900 watt HID Northlights - continuous lighting for exactly this reason...I can more easily see what I will get - WYSIWYG

    One trick that you can try is to include a Rare Earth magnet in the image. It should be the dark but shiny kind. As you adjust the camera polarizer you will find that it [the magnet] will go from shiny to black with ever so slight a twist in rotation, and thus create too much contrast as well. You will need to experiment. Also note that the profile will need to be made with the SG chart shot at the same exact rotation to be truly useful. The "In Camera" profile will tame the excess contrast as well.

    Good Shooting!
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  • Grant Kernan
    Something else comes to mind. I shoot art with the intent of capturing texture, but this can be overdone. My main light will skim the surface, usually placed further away to help keep the leading edge from being too bright. The second or fill light is used at a lower power and it is less oblique [used to fill in or open the shadows created by the first light].

    Even so the lighting will not be totally even.

    The correction requires Capture One's LCC filter. I use the LCC dialled back somewhat or specular highlights will become overemphasized. I was noticing that at 100% specular highlights are worse.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Thanks Grant,

    I will look at those lights, I use the Robin Myers Polarizer Alignment card at the bottom of my image when rotating my polarizing filter on the my camera. I have a bucket list of gear I want to up grade. 1. my monitor from a apple cimema display to a Ezio display and new constant lights.

    Thanks so much for sharing.
    Martin
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  • Grant Kernan
    Yes Robin Meyers makes a good alignment card. I met Robin 7 years ago at a Betterlight conference in San Carlos California.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    WOW those are not cheep lights $3200 per light. I need to increase the biz before I order a pair of those.
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  • Grant Kernan
    You may not need those lights if you are not shooting with a scan back. Less expensive LED and strobes would be more appropriate with DSLR and Phase Backs/Cameras. At any rate Dave no longer manufactures the Northlight. He closed his business a year or so ago as did Mike at Betterlight. So Betterlights and Northlights are only available used on Ebay or through Archetype Imaging.
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  • Martin A. Lavallee
    Thanks for the info,
    Right now I'm using a Norman P4000XT power pack with LH2400 heads with 10 inch reflector with polorization in front.
    I also have a pair of 14x48 strip box that I haven't tried working with yet.
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