Adding Analog/Negative FILM Conversion Features
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What problem do you see this solving?
Analog photography is back and we need comprehensive tools for editing
As analog/negative film becomes (again) part of many photographers workflows and producing repro/macro shots of negative film with digital cameras becomes more prominent, I would really love to see an option for CaptureOne Pro that would allow native conversion of negative film from RAW.
A hidden feature?
This feature is already available, but only for CaptureOne CH (Cultural Heritage) users. There are work arounds, but tools like Negative Lab Pro became very popular for a reason. Unfortunately this plug-in is only available for Adobe Lightroom. As far as I understand, plug-in architecture of CaptureOne does not allow the tight integration a tool like Negative Lab Pro requires. So we are kind of stuck here. I am aware of the fact that you can invert the curves, but this is not a very convenient neither very consistent approach with reproducible results across multiple shoots and film brands. So why not opening the already present CH feature to all of us? It would be an initial step to cover this market. From there on more (current) film brands could be implemented.
When was the last time you were affected by this lack of functionality, or specific tool?
Any time I would take a macro shot of an analog film with my mirrorless I would have to jump through hoops to create a positive, editable image in my C1 library.
Are you using any workarounds or other solutions to achieve your goals in Capture One?
For Mac users a tool called "Analogue Toolbox" by Michael Wilmes is available (see below). His workaround does an excellent job, but unfortunately it is hampered by technical limitations within C1. He is very knowledgeable and helpful, but it is upon the C1 engineers to take the next step.
Are you happy to be contacted further about this suggestion or request?
YES
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Norman, just to confirm, you’re aware this thread is for conversion of negatives to positives via capture one, Not creating film presets for images that are already positives.
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yes...i shoot film. i want a way to edit black and white film, 35/ 120....i shoot film i dont need a way to make my photos look like film...
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Norman........
You can currently "edit" your positive film conversions in Capture One, black and white or color or anything you want. I do this all the time with my own film I shoot. Now typically this is only color management for consistency around skin tones and also midtone exposure correction. Your use of the word edit is what I was referring to. "Conversion" of your black and white film negatives to positives in Capture One would be amazing and is a big part of what we are hoping Phase One / Capture One brings functionality for instead of trying to get us to purchase a whole other heritage package.
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Conversion of negative to positive is one part of the picture, however C1 appears to have a problem with mono images and requires everything to be converted to RGB. This is another problem with the process because and average 120 scan from a Nikon scanner weighs in at about 165mb in mono and 450 - half a gigabyte in RGB. Not only do these files take ages to save, load, copy etc. they take up disc space at a terrible rate.
I was interested to see how the heritage package might handle this but apart from a few links on the web, couldn't find any documentation or a trial on the C1 website.
C1's apathy to this topic, the second-class file handling and dialogs in C1, the emphasis on iPhone compatibility, make me wonder if it's all worthwhile. I regularly get badgered by ON1 about new features and reasonably priced offers. All C1 seems to offer is subscriptions for the same old software. Hmmmmm.
JC
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Danny,
Yes it is possible to invert negatives but many tools work the other way round, which can be confusing if you also edit digital images or transparencies.
John,
Fully agree, support of greyscale images would be awesome.
Do you use ON1 for your analog images?
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Adding an expert negative film conversion tool would make Capture One an attractive option for the Photo Management and conversion community. Lightroom dominates for lack of a viable alternative.
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I currently own C1 23 and would also love to have a conversion feature built in. Apparently SilkyPix now has a tool to do this. Has anyone tried it or compared it to Negative Lab Pro?
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This shouldn't even be a request at this point, it's long overdue especially considering how long Negative Lab has been available. Can we hope to see this in an update soon? Thanks!
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How large is the community of interest for this feature? Capture One will need to weigh return on investment.
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Walter, market demand is large enough that it supports a stand-alone product (Negative Lab Pro). The only people who can really answer your question on the financials are the folks at Capture One. There is also an issue of loss avoidance for C1. There are clearly customers who us C1 and who are looking for a conversion feature. They might switch to a competitor if they don't get a solution from C1. Frankly, I'm in that boat.
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Frankly, I am very disappointed in C1. It was many years ago that this feature became a request, and we still do not have any feedback from C1 that they are even considering it. Anyway, C1 lost me with their new so-called "Loyalty" program. Obviously, I am not the target group anymore. So goodbye then, it was a nice ride. I now reluctantly use Adobe Lightroom, which I have to admit has made a lot of progress since I last used it. I mostly shoot digital, but Negative Lab Pro is an impressive and decent option for analog negative to digital conversion.
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Walter - I am a member of The Photo Managers [thephotomanagers.com] which has several hundred professional members worldwide who help consumers, small business, and institutions digitize and organize photos. We are at an inflection point where the need for high volume efficient scanning is pressing these (mostly) solo operators to seek out better solutions than the traditional flatbed and negative scanners. In just the last 4 years that solution has become camera scanning which can capture as much as 800 images per hour. This industry is growing and has caught the attention of software and hardware companies that recognize a need for new capture and DAM solutions that are accessible and affordable for small studios and solo businesspeople. To date, the software of choice has been Lightroom Classic, for lack of a better solution, but key parts of that solution depend on 3rd party plug-ins or supporting apps. LrC also has a steep learning curve and some basic limitations with image handling.
Because Capture One has well integrated camera tethering, it is well suited to camera scanning and is potentially a more straightforward solution than LrC. Since Capture One already has a negative conversion feature in its Heritage version, it seems like that would be an easy and cost effective edition to C1. Not only that, but it is likely that the Heritage edition also features better handling of metadata than the public C1 and might outshine LrC in multiple ways. Perhaps this requires nothing more than making the Heritage edition software available to all. It seems like a simple way for Capture One to launch a whole new revenue stream in a growth market with very little development time or expense.
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Thanks very much Paul for your insightful information. Hopefully Capture One will take this into consideration.
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Paul Einarsen At $US5K, Heritage version will never be a cost effective and therefore never easily accessible for most except those with deep pockets. For those who have the kind of money to afford say, a Phase One camera, it might not seem like much, but for most it is a ridiculous price. But it's great for excluding potential competitors from the scanning market.
I own C1 20, and will not purchase an upgrade or any other edition until this is available in the product at a not-extortionist price point. In fact, I am actively telling people to avoid C1 for this reason. Most people I know who would use it, also do at least some film shooting.
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This thread is truly proof that hope springs eternal. After over three years it should be apparent that C1 could care less about this. I won't be upgrading what I go and am using other products at this time. To be honest I found the design to be heading in a more convoluted direction anyway. But yeah, they could get some market share for putting this in, but they do not need our money and could care less. I see more AI airbrushing in their future and nothing about analog plug-ins.
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Agreed. It's really a case of "talk to the hand because the face ain't listening". Not sure why though. I have seen companies decide that their product cannot compete in a particular market and let it die a slow death and not invest more money. Other than that, I'm fairly baffled.
People used to talk about 80/80 software… something which did 80% of the tasks for 80% of the customers. I don't think I would rate C1 at much better than 60/20 at the moment.
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At $US5K, Heritage version will never be a cost effective and therefore never easily accessible for most except those with deep pockets.
The question (for the C1 company) is, would the CH edition sell if this feature would be available in the Pro edition. (Provided there are no other questions/considerations like the before assumed license rights of an external party). There are institutions who do not arcive photographic (negative) material but only other heritage, putting this feature into the Pro edition would not change a bit.
But revenue for the CH edition from other archiving institutions might drop, if the other features in CH are not reason enough to stay with it, and only C1 can assess how much that would be and if it would be outweighed by additional Pro edition sales.
Btw, does anybody know if the CH edition perpetual license need to be repurchased at full prize after two years of not upgrading, like the Pro edition, or if the CH edition can be subscribed to?
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I would also like to add my support for this request. I have a pile of negatives that I have to scan and I am extremely reluctant to use Lightroom. I am really hoping that this will be implemented soon!
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If you support this request please go to the original post and press the "^" (up arrow) to "upvote" the request.
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Voting in favor of a negative conversion tool. ^
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Please bring the Film Conversion tool to regular Capture One Pro users! - I've also voted.
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Capture One Cultural Heritage has a "mode" dropdown menu to change the default operating mode from Photography to Film Negative or Film Positive, depending on the film type captured.
I think it should not be too complicated to integrate this to Capture One Pro. Maybe there are licensing problems (Capture One, Phase One, Capture One CH: same or different companies?)
In the meantime, inverting of levels or curves is possible with the help of a style.
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I found some information regarding »Scanning film negatives with Capture One» here: https://medium.com/@benjamin.bezine/scanning-film-negatives-with-capture-one-e707d52c9b7a
I tried to use the scripts on my MacBook Pro according to the information and suggestions pointed out in the link above, and it worked quite well, if I may say so.
If the URL doesn't show up here in the forum, try to search for:
»Scanning film negatives with Capture One»
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Thanks Edwardsson ! - I'm the author of the page you mention. Glad you liked it, but I would still much prefer if it were a feature of Capture One... please C1 people, if you hear us...
In the meantime, feel free to share any suggestion for improvement!
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Thanks, Benjamin Bezine for the script! I have tried it and so far it works very well. Will be using it much more after the New Year, when I will try to scan some old negative slides that have been lying around in my drawer.
I agree with you on the wish to have this feature implemented within C1.
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Isn't the free 'plugin' Analog Toolbox for Capture One doing the same as this script but faster and more (and free)? Search for that name in case this Facebook group link won't work : https://www.facebook.com/groups/141662290513120
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No idea, I don't have a Facebook account.
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I made one especially for this and thought it was worth it. I think someone else might appreciate the info.
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Now I found a website (outside FB) with more information regarding the tool:https://michael-wilmes.format.com/toolbox
Thanks for the advice to search for the tools. But I apparently still need FB to be able to download the tools. 😩
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Analog Toolbox and the scripts are only for Apple wonks who have more dollars than sense. Others like me aren't interested in looking cool and would rather keep our money to get all we need from a system for for half as much. The amount of money I save on not buying Apple comparing the specs on my current machine with Apple's current offerings, roughly $1.5k will pay for 7 or 8 years of photoshop plus negative lab pro ($100). F Capture One. I had it for years. And they lost me. I had talked a bunch of people into buying it before, and now I regret it for just this. I'm unsubscribing from this thread as it is dead and useless. Happy Wednesday.
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