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Recursive view and multiple selection

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31 comments

  • NN96041

    this is gonna need a lot of pressure since it's been known and requested for some time

    there's workarounds, or i should say they are forcing us to do it the C1 way with sessions groups albums and filters

     

    what you're requesting would simplify workflows for many and while keeping their methods for who needs them, but oh well

    2015 https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=100084.0

    2016 https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=113327.0

    2018 https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=123089.0

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  • SFA

    Enrico,

    I think you also need to create a Request that will be properly managed in the support case system.

    Are you shooting tethered and using sessions? If so do you make use of Session Templates?

    Have you looked at the additional features in the Enterprise version of C1? I think it is probably the version that is aimed more specifically at your type of needs.

    It may not offer what you describe as your requirement but is likely to be the specialized version of C1 that can best be justified (by the product managers) for adaptations for the sort of use that you have described.

    It would probably be worth being familiar with it even if only to be able to tell the developers why is does not currently suit your requirements for the way you wish to work!

    Grant

    1
  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    The example post of 2018 and other Posts linked by NN96041 could be done by using Metadata. And it could be done theat way even better than by doing it with Folders.
    After importing The first step is Always to fill in the meta data of Location and copy it to all Pictures of that Import. Than thoe Pictures are already grouped by coutnry, cits and Location and can easily be found. And on top of it (refereing that linked 2018 post) I can type in "zoo" in filter and get all Zoos in all countrys. 

    Also another user wants to browse by date "Folders" while Browsing by date can be done inside C1 no matter what Folders the Pictures are in.

    I am relative new to C1 and started in September 2019. Before that I did Video for over 10 years owning a big Archive with lots of Folder Organisation. And I have to admit the way C1 does it is far better than thinking in file foldes, but it feels weird at first time. I have Chosen to organize my Picture Folders by Event Name and a generic Folder per year. But with use of some tags and meta data I can find Pictures even faster.

    I started to complain to myself About the lack of not Browsing Folders but I have to admit the way C1 does it is better. And its even more powerful when using tags or batch renaming on Import so the file Name reflects the Project or something worth to be mentioned as being a filter. e.g a filename like event-customer-date-counter. I do that with makros on Import.
    just my two Cents, think About it and try it out. When a beginner like me can organize over 10 K photos and find everything in split seconds even faster thatn Browsing in Folders it can't be that bad - it's opposite.

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  • NN96041

    we're talking about sessions. are you working with catalog?. how are you making date filter work for subfolders?

     

    folder structure like this example:

    photos 

      -> jan

      -> feb

     

    if i open 'sessions' and navigate to "photos" i cant select any dates since there are no photos in it. they are all in subfolders

    there's no amount of tags going to make anything show up when i select 'photos' 

     

     

     

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  • Walter Rowe

    You have to look in the Filters Tool. If the Filters Tool isn't visible, right-click and "Add Tool > Filter". The Filters Tool has an automatic date-based filter. Choose All Images in your session, then filter by date:

    Year > Month > Day of Month

    Location works the same way

    Country > State/Province > City > Location

     

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  • NN96041

    how do you select all images if they are in subfolders?

    im in a root folder called 'photos' that contains only subfolders where the photos are - like jan/feb/

     

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  • Walter Rowe

    In the Library Tool there is a selection called All Images. Sessions and Catalogs have this.

    Catalog:

    Session:

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  • NN96041

    well there's the problem i hope you understand now what we're dealing with

     

    All Images is a 'smart album' that includes 'Session Folder', 'Albums' and 'Favorites'. 

    so a workaround that's mentioned in one of the forum posts includes adding your folders you want to work with to 'favorites' temporarily

     

    There have been other suggestions all revolving around usage of smart albums, using multiple 'sessions' or just switching to catalogs but a simple recursive option combined with folder multi selection would solve all these issues and keep the existing workflows

     

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  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    Even if I have organized my Video work in Folder structure for over a Dekade I now see now Advantage of doing so anymore. Like we are using Google: We do not want to "browse" through Topics and Folders, we just type in what we are Looking for. 
    In my opinion it's more a "I did it for yearts, i Need this" - Thing.
    When I want to work with, let's say, all photos of a Special year I can browse by filter tool. And if I use a fodler structure by year, I can do that. But what if I want to select all photos of a Special Person or Event?
    As soon as I have two or more criteria a Folder structure eats up time because I can only browse by one criteria that was Chosen when Building the Folder structure. And then Ihave to take a look at each photo and search for it by clicking through. That is of no efficeny at all. I stuck to folder structure for too long when I look back. Now a simple structure by event or project to keep the disk speed high (lots of files in a directory always slow down access to files) and working with meta data gives far more options in quick access. Open your mind :)

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  • Enrico Tabacchi

    Thanks for the comments but you're going a little off topic.

    You are on a photo set, you are acquiring images remotely, you have taken 2000 photos, to create 20 different looks.

    The customer requests that everything be divided into folders on the file system.

    The customer approaches you and asks to see all the photos of three specific looks, taken at different times of the day. Being able to compare the photos with each other.

    With capture one to do such a thing you have to do a lot of steps, create a temporary album where to throw everything in and create confusion at the archive level. On Lightroom select the three folders of the three different looks and that's it, you already have all the photos you need, all in one place, clean and tidy.

    You talk about dates and places, but those are problems, without offense of course, of an amateur photographer, not a professional.

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  • BeO

    I am not saying that the possibilities C1 offers are better in all cases for everyone, or for everyones preferred workflow, but what I want to say is that I find it very refreshing to hear somebody open minded having tried to figure out a workflow which works best for him, given the tool at hand, and it resulted in a workflow even better than the wokflow he was used to work with, and report and try to help here with such a positive attitude. Very refreshing.

    cheers Jehuda

    regards

    BeO

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  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    Thanks Beo :)

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  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    Enrico, I kept my examples simple.
    In your example you have to have that structure already to select those Folders in Lightroom. So you took time to create that structure. If you would have taken the same time to create it inside C1 insetad on hard drive you could Archive exactly the same. It assumes that you have grouped your files before so then you can select those Folders. So you put a lot of work into that organisation already.
    What if -. in your exanple - the customer approaches you and ask for Fotos of three Looks gourped by time instead of look? 

    I do not work as a professional but for fun and Passion. I do a lot of Sports photography in Soccer. Divided by Season/game. When I am asked to deliver photos of one player taken at different games it is done quickly by filtering tah name->create Album and using a recipie that does the grouping for me. And when 10 minues later another customer wants Pictures from that game and the previous I do not have to browse to find those games - I filter for the Team names and again choose a recipie whith macros doing the grouping. 

    Having a structure you can only deliver that structure but waste tons of times if the customer statrs request in a way of grouping you didn't use when you grouped them. 

    Tha way I can deliver any structure the customer wants but organize it my way. Looks flexible for the customer lke it is while I do not need to ask him before I even Import if he ever wants that shots to be grouped in Looks so I can mark that Folders later when he asks for it. That is a very static Approach. Maybe it works for you and your Kind of customers.

    I do that as an Amateur in addition to my full time Job as freelance. Delivering the same material to different cosutomers with different Needs of having them grouped together any Folder-structure-thinking on Import would only suit one.

    Maybe thats why big Picture companies use meta data to organize. I got a bit over 10 K Pictures by now taken in 2,5 month of Soccer season. That Maybe 100 K in a year. What if C1 could do what you request and I click on the main Folder by accident - it would Show previews for tons of files, slowing down my while work. Maybe thats why some Lightroom users call it to slow. Because they work in that Folder-with-preview-way. 

    Give it a try like I did. I am conviced you love it once you find how flexible and fast it is. No thinking of Organisation on Import. Just tag them with the Information useful and what you think of maybe they could be grouped, in your case Maybe shot (time of day), look, customer, Location. Then you can find any look at any time on any Location and Group them in any crazy way the customer wants them on Export.

    -2
  • BeO

    Enrico,

    There is one requirement of the customer which might lead you to the assumption you need to create folders and subfolders:

    The customer requests that everything be divided into folders on the file system.

    Sometimes customers requirements need to be fulfilled, no matter what. I understand. So, let's find a solution for this. 

    Assuming you can distinguish the images at the time of import regarding Look, for example (you can, otherwise you could not spread them into different folders in your current workflow). After import you can set a IPTC field of your choice to hold the information about the Look.

    During the evaluation / image comparison, you can use All images in combination with filters, or you define smart albums based on filter criteria.

    After the evaluation, you can export the images, processed to jpg, tiff or else, into a folder structure of your choice which C1 creates for you on export automatically, based on tokens like the IPTC field of your choice which holds the Look, or even divide into more subfolders based on other metadata information. Note that it is not possible with keywords I believe, so you might use keywords but when you need tokens for export you would need to select images by keyword and set an IPTC field accordingly.

    And you can do this also with the original raw files (export into subfolders by using tokens to define the subfolder names).

    So you should be able to fulfill and provide the files according your customers requirements, without even having to create the folder structure by yourself or moving images into static albums.

    Does this sounds as a viable solution to you and your customers requirements?

    About the time savings or if you need more time I cannot really assess, but I can imagine it is about the same, once you are familiar with this approach, and you gain more flexibilty on top.

    regards

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  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    Again, thanks BeO. I hope you two guys don't mind if I sounded more complicated but english is not my native language. BeO pointed out even better what I wanted to say and Show.

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  • BeO

    Thanks, Jehuda, no one should mind if there is a helping attitude. As a non-native speaker I am missing some nuances of the language or culture, hence I often understand non-native speakers better :-) Regards.

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  • NN96041

    i mean i see how you guys are working but that really does not work the same for everyone. it is more complicated to use albums, smart albums and filters

    enrico complained about that in the first paragraph and it seems to be completely ignored and i agree with him 

     

    you should be able to select whatever folders in system folders you want and see all the pictures and apply whatever filters if you want. im not sure why that is so complicated or radical

    you get to keep whatever workflows you are using right now

    recursive folders can be a checkbox, or right click operation. it would simplify everything. if you want to move files it would be way easier to just drag them around when they are multi selected instead of this IPTC nonsense and import metadata and exports

     

     

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  • BeO

    Well, let me put it that way: if you are using words like nonsense in posts directed to users who want to help getting aquaintened to the new software you have chosen then I would very much encourage you to go back to LR or at least stop posting here !!! Nobody needs this here, maybe this is LR user attitude but then you might feel at home there and should go back!

    And nobody stops you from submittting a request to C1, but until you get this feature, if ever, you might want to make use of this "nonsense" with or without our advice!

    go figure! 

    No regards

    -1
  • NN96041

    never used LR in my life and i didnt submit this feature request either. wake up man people have different needs than you so stop forcing them to use what works for you doesnt work for many many

    you should go back to the echo chamber where you came from as well

     

    no regards lol so small

     

     

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  • BeO

    First of all, nobody in this thread did ignore Enrico, as we posted something here.

    Second, nobody here said this is a nonsense desire he or you have.

    And nobody here was forcing anybody to anything but rather gave suggestions how one can possibly work with C1 to achive what is required.

    I even acknowledged that the option you have with C1 is not for everyones' workflow, so tell me can't you read?

    what did you expect, a shitstorm against C1, or hundreds of users singing the same song as yours? In what bubble you live in? 

    What kind of help did you offer to Enrico other than singing his song, did you encourage him to submit a request? Did you show him a way to work with C1?  You only emphasize the negative points and find always some point which cannot be done, no matter what people suggest, instead of what can be done. And if you cannot argue anymore meaningful, your plain reply is that this is all nonsense what we suggest. This tells a lot more about you than you might think...

    Ah, and sorry, I didn't want to make you feel so small.

     

    -2
  • NN96041

    this is a feature request forum. what are you on about

    i posted links from 2015 until 2018 showing many people requested this and he's definitely not alone

     

    what exactly do you think the point of this forum is, this is the request side. if you don't agree with a feature request stay out or downvote

     

    stop lecturing

     

     

    2
  • BeO

    I did not say he is alone, nor do I downvote this topic, I encourage people to submit requests to the company even if I do not need or like it, which is not the case with this request, because in the end the number of users requesting something is relevant for the company and user base. Unlike you I have not eaten all the wisdom of the world. You do not seem to understand me at all, that's becoming more and more clear.

    And yes this is the forum to discuss feature requests, feel free to do so, but don't debase other users opinions and posts in the way you did, they might feel offended. If that's your personal thing you like to do, well, I told you already what I think about it. It seems you might need some lectures from some soft skill trainer, not from me certainly for this purpose.

    I am getting bored by you so fare well. Basta e Ciao.

     

    -3
  • NN96041

    yikes. good riddance

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  • Jehuda Waeltermann

    Please be patient, guys.
    This is a request feature Forum but even the amount of users requesting a feature does not mean by default that it is a good one or that it does fit into the workflow. Beeing a developer myself I learned that many, even most feature requests are based on the fact that people switch from one Software to another and expect that old workflow to be the same.

    But sometimes there are reasons that it is not. So one solution of the Software company is to add that feature and one solution is to open the mind for that different workflow.

    I did the last one and what do I say: It works better. That is what BeO and I wanted point out. Sometimes People ask for a feature simply because the are stuck in their own workflow and I am no exception to this. C1 does a different approach and that is really worth looking at it.

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  • F Straker

    Having the ability to access / manipulate objects (folders, user collections) in a hierarchical fashion is IMHO a real no-brainer. Didn't DOS do that already? This kind of request is around for years. It is quite surprising that we even have to discuss.

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  • SFA

    Relational database have been around for years as well - but still we cling to manually generated and managed folder structures.

    The person who invented the filing cabinet  - and thus the skill of misfiling things - may need to be questioned about their motives.

     

    ;)

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  • F Straker

    Fully agree. I am all in favor of working preferably with attributes (ratings, labels, keywords, etc.).

    However, I see the one click aggregate folder / album view just as a "keyboard shortcut" for a frequently used "query" yielding the same results. Its ubiquitously present and C1 should have it too.

    If  one "loose the folders" design principle is becoming fashionable with C1 development BTW I wonder what about the "move to _Reject folder" menu item.

    ;-)

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  • Lily

    Hi Enrico,

    Thank you for your comments and suggestions provided.

    Your request on the recursive view (#26517) has been handled by the Support Team and has been forwarded to the Product Management.

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  • Enrico Tabacchi

    Hello, any news?

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  • LightRoomConvert

    "In your example you have to have that structure already to select those Folders in Lightroom. So you took time to create that structure. If you would have taken the same time to create it inside C1 insetad on hard drive you could Archive exactly the same."

    How, exactly?

    As I tried to explain here: https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/360014198838-How-to-select-files-in-multiple-folders-If-not-possible-what-is-the-next-best-alternative-Albums-cannot-be-nested it's not just that refiling years of photos is a thankless task; it's that, even if you wanted to do it, how would you do it?

    You cannot nest albums one into the other. If you want some kind of hierarchical structure, like:

     

    ---- 2019

    ---- ---- Laura's wedding

    ---- ---- ---- Wedding

    ---- ---- ---- Honeymoon

    ---- ---- New York Holiday

    ---- ---- ---- Manhattan

    ---- ---- ---- Brooklyn

    ---- ---- Christmas

     

    How would you do it?

     

    The lack of this most banal feature is the only thing keeping me from leaving Lightroom - and I am not the only one.

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