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X-Rite Colorchecker Calibration

Not currently planned

Comments

35 comments

  • Official comment
    Mathieu B
    Product Manager

    Hi everyone, 
    Thank you for the suggestion - this is not something we are currently working on.

    This does not mean this is a bad suggestion or that it will never be adressed, but in an effort of transparency we want you to know that we are not currently allocating resources to solving this issue.

    We will revisit the status of this thread if and when it changes.

  • Martin Kostra

    I agree with you, it would be great function.

    3
  • Stephen K Mack

    Yes, please!

    3
  • Hattie

    great idea

    3
  • C-M-B

    Well the problem that I see is that with the current X-rite software you can't get correct profiles for Capture One because the black values are wrong.

    So right now you wouldn't be able to get correct profiles even if it was implemented...

     

    2
  • Stephen K Mack

    Chris,

    The results that I'm getting trying to do custom profiles  makes sense now. I tried to create a custom profile for my Nikon with the color checker passport and couldn't get the blacks to look right. I did it couple of times thinking that maybe my studio lights had created a subtle highlight or something on the black square.

    1
  • C-M-B

    Yeah the only way to do it is with Lumariver - but you'd have to buy the Pro version to get ICC profiles and that's so expensive you might as well get a different solution from another brand anyway.

    0
  • Lily

    Hi Bennett,

     

    Thank you for feedback on Capture One - this is always welcomed and encouraged among our users and we appreciate the time you've taken to contribute towards the development of the software.

    I have forwarded your comments and suggestions to our Product Management team as something to consider in a future release.

    Whilst we cannot comment on future releases, we take all suggestions on board and hopefully your feedback contributes towards a future version of Capture One.

    1
  • Christian Schmieder

    Yes, that would be nice, if it was finally possible! The Hasselblad Phocus Software has this already implemented.
    But for now I'm using 3DLutCreator, with this I get an average precision rate of about 1.5 out of the automatic first attempt (ColorChecker SG Digital and Passport, I also did measurements and compared it to the official x-rite reference RGB/Lab values), manual fine tuning for even more precission is possible. Also I get a more accurate profile than with for example basiccolor input 5, in version 6 Pro manual fine tuning is now also possible. With 3DLC you can also create own color grades / styles and save them as ICC profiles and import them to Capture One.

    1
  • Leo FABRIZIO

    Would like to see too that x-rite implementation on C1. The actual method with ColorChecker Passport is absolutely biased, plus the gamut reading is too short for the quality of C1.

    I absolutely would like to see an effective solution working with the ColorChecker SG Digital or DT cultural heritage targets on C1 Pro.

    thanks

    0
  • C-M-B

    Better yet - something like Lumariver that's tailored to CaptureOne so you can use your own targets with specific values.

    0
  • Leo FABRIZIO

    Are you familiar to it?

    Although I would prefer an embedded solution as it is so commun nowadays to use color targets to edit profiles, I am considering the alternatives, like Lumariver or Basiccolor, (GoldenThread is not running in Mac).

    Considering the price, it's a commitment to choose the right one to fit the jobS I need it for.

    For exemple, if you are familiar to Lumariver, could you tell me if it would be possible to create a customized ICC Profile with inverted curves, to use it for negatives scan?

    Thanks for your answer, that would help me a lot.

     

     

     

     

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    Besides lumariver (couldn’t test or measure the created profile cause I only had the trialversion of it, saving profiles where not possible), you should check out 3DLutCreator. It has in the ICC export settings a special checkbox for Capture One with that you will get the correct C1 gamma value and your blacks should be fine. I tried basiccolor 5 and 6 and both can‘t get for example the blacks for C1 right, the profile is too bright by roughly 0,5 points in the overall brightness. I was able to compensate that a little by dragging the levels middle slider in C1 to the left, -0.06 points. But this is not a worthy method if you need overall accurate colors.
    I do color critical jobs and the only satisfying solution at the moment for me is 3DLC. With it you can not only create C1 icc profiles that meet the target specifications, but you can also create own colorgrades for C1. For example all the ProEDU C1 styles/profiles are made with 3DLC. For the money that you would spent on lumariver repro edition (most accurate version) plus a little more, with 3DLC you’ll get an amazing versatile tool that does more than just creating target profiles. Here are 3 videos how to create icc profiles in 3DLC:
    1. Getting precise colors in Capture One
    https://youtu.be/_uL1CulnbcY
    2. Making color profiles for Capture One in 3D LUT Creator
    https://youtu.be/KOyETEwNt2k
    3. How to use LUT's in Capture One? Making your own ICC profiles!
    https://youtu.be/McRO_RmgD0E

    It has its learning curve but totally worth it and colorgrading possibilities for color and bw are endless. You can also use any kind of existing luts out there to tweak them to your taste, also being able to separate the color from the contrast curve or separate a lut in 3 independent parts (HSL/Mastercurve/ChannelCurves, even CMYK is possible). By the way, would be also interested, if someone has experience with the lumariver correction profile, inkl. comparison measurements to the color target reference values. Hope that could help a little.

    Cheers

    1
  • Christian Schmieder

    Creating Negative Scan ICC Profiles with an inverted Curve for C1 is also possible with 3DLC.

    0
  • Leo FABRIZIO

    thanks for your comment although I am quite surprised with your comment about Basiccolor:

    I tried basiccolor 5 and 6 and both can‘t get for example the blacks for C1 right, the profile is too bright by roughly 0,5 points in the overall brightness. I was able to compensate that a little by dragging the levels middle slider in C1 to the left, -0.06 points. But this is not a worthy method if you need overall accurate colors.

    As it is used a recommended by DT Culture Heritage as a software for ICC editing, to obtain certified reproductions, I would be very very surprised the ICC produced is so of the charts, plus considering the 500 to 800€ investment!

    I will try a shot to 3D LUT Creator although I thing part of the problem is the ColorChecker passport chart itself that had not even charts for a good results. Did you try it with the SG version? I am also looking for a software capable of working in the future with more complexe or different color targets like Don Williams' ones.

    Creating Negative Scan ICC Profiles with an inverted Curve for C1 is also possible with 3DLC.

    That's something! Would you mind to do one and share? Look a the post about negative scanning... many people would be interested in that fonction if when the "inverted" color profile is applied the process in C1 would not be inverted. Could be nice if you could try or share such a profile!

     

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    I was also surprised that I had this problem with basiccolor, when you consider it’s price. I used version 5 for quite a time and thought that it would be fine, until I started measuring the target patches and compare it to the reference values. I don’t know for sure what the problem is or was. But it seemed that the needed C1 one gamma value was not considered in the calculation of the icc profile. In bassiccolor 6 (i only had the basic version as a trail), in the pro version, there you can fine tune the patches manually. But after my experience with version 5... Maybe there was a problem on my side?
    Basiccolor has the possibility to use two chart simultaneously, for example the colorchecker basic plus a greyscale card.
    Maby that could have fixed something? I dont know.

    Color Checker passport has some additional patches besides the regular ones. Basiccolor only uses the regular ones for creating the profile, whereas 3DLC uses both! The regular and the additional ones for creating the profile!
    I use the color checker basic chart the big one and the small one, also the SG version and passport version. Funny enough I couldnt even get a useful profile out of basiccolor when using its own target (I had the target that was like a box with a hole in the middle, don’t know the name of it anymore). I kind of had constantly problems with basiccolor somehow.
    I have no experience with the Don Williams one, also has its price.
    In general, the target has to be evenly lit, especially the colorchecker SG. Because it has several black patches and when some of them are too bright and some too dark, you could get into trouble. Also important when creating the tif file for profile calculation always correct the lens vignetting! When the vignette creates a shadow on the patches on the edge of the target they are too dark and calculation a correct profile could be problematic, white balance should be also considered. (Nothing new I guess but just wanted to mention it again)
    Negative profile, i can try creating one, although with the C1 onboard tools you can easily create a custom style with inverted curves.
    Ok I’ll try one. But how can I share it here?
    I’ll load it on my cloud space and post the link here.

    Cheers

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    Ok, i created a inverted curve ICC profile for Capture One (I now also understood what is the point for something like that - inverted adjustments in C1, havn't read the neg scanning post, and personally for me no problem, when some sliders are inverted, I did not even considered it being a problem at all, left is right and right is left, when you are able to realise it, you are able to adapt to it :) .

    I tried the profile, but strangely enough, also with the profile the sliders, for axample Exposure, behave like the inverted C1 curve method, slider is inverted, seems no difference wheter you Invert the curve in C1 or use an inverted curve profile. I don't understand the math behind that, tried some other things aswell. I guess the people in neg scan post are already through everything I just did.

    here is the profile anyway:

    https://my.hidrive.com/lnk/3ciFCZj5

    You can also created an inverted icc curve profile with photoshop.

    Just create a curves adjustmensts layer, invert the curve and with Export > Color lookup tables you created your ICC profile.

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    Just if someone is interested:

    3DLutCreator - Professional Edition (all features) is currently on sale for 186$ approx 151 EUR vs.

    Lumariver Repro Edition, 200 EUR.

    Cheers and Happy New Year!

    0
  • Martin Engmann

    Nah, you only need the Pro Version of Lumariver. This edition currently costs 100 EUR. With that you can create ICC profiles with high resolution LUT (2.5 D). This works like a charm and creates fantastic results for Capture One.

    With Repro Edition you can even create color profiles with 3D LUT Type. But this makes sense in highly controlled conditions only and if you have strict reproduction work.

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    Yes, guess you are right.
    For common Profiles for C1 that should be fine or for common purposes overall.
    I'm working in a color critical environment, reproduction work and stuff. Between the differences in the lumariver editions, I read 2.5 D vs. 3 D LUT and the Repro-Edition would have been the only possible Option for me. 👍

    Would be interesting then if the C1 StandardPro or C1 Generic Kamera Profiles made by C1 for every supported camera, would be sufficient enough for most people or most common purposes, instead of investing in a 2.5 profile or how they stand up against each other?

    Have you compared them?

    0
  • Christian Schmieder

    Further on the basicclor input software:
    It seems that version 6 is now fully compatible with C1 no gamma problem as I had with version 5.

    0
  • Martin Engmann

    @Christian Schmieder:

    > Have you compared them?

    Yes, I compared them (a lot). For me the difference is quite significant, especially the skin tones and and the blues are noticeable. The generic profiles from Capture One tends to shift colors slightly into red. With generic profiles you see orangy yellows and magenta like blues. I experienced this with Canon and Fujifilm cameras as well. I wanted to get rid of this with ColorChecker Passport and Lumariver. It worked.

    The reference was the X-Rite Plugin in Lightroom and the default color profile from Fujifilm (Provia), which Fuji users can apply as a curve in CaptureOne). I compared the results on my color calibrated monitor.

    The Lumariver results are very close to the Lightroom calibration variant in terms of color accuracy and contrast. Additionally the Fujifilm Provia profile is a bit more punchy and vivid in comparison to Lumariver but has nearly the same colors.

    0
  • ninjatune

    If you search for this topic you'll see that there are requests going back 12 years (?!?!?) to have this feature added to Capture One.

    Is it worth buying an X-Rite Colour Checker when there's no straight forward way to integrate it with Capture One?

    I'm having second thoughts as I was just about to purchase one, but seeing a lot of people questions/comments on here it's making me question that idea.

    Are there any alternatives that are worth pursuing? Thanks

    0
  • Martin Engmann

    If you take the cost of purchasing the color target and a viable icc creation software into account, then it's barely worth it. Here you are quickly at >200 EUR and also consider the whole effort for the calibration, usage, test, ...

    The alternative could be the free XRite software (ColorChecker Camera Calibration) but with limited results.

    The new CaptureOne ProStandard profiles look the most promising. If you own a supported camera, I would try that first. If your camera is not supported then submit a request.
    If you are a Fuji-X user, then meanwhile stick with the Provia or ProNeg profiles.

    1
  • Denis Huk
    Admin

    Moved from the archive on 22.05.23.

    0
  • FirstName LastName

    This issues has been on going for years yet nothing from capture one's product management. If the would even create their own color capture card id be fine with that. But nothing after three years of asking gives me less hope this will ever be resolved.

    0
  • Leo FABRIZIO

    Since X-rite is out of the game now, it will never for sure.

    basICColor is the easiest way to go.

    Digit Transition just announced the DT FADGI Flow Software, but certainly a quite serious investment.

    0
  • Damani Adadevoh

    Adding to this convo. I have to move over to Capture One from Darktable and I’m not happy about it. For me the only pro of Capture One is its long list of compatible cameras. I’ve really loved Darktable especially for its integrated color checker workflow. But unfortunately its tethered capture environment is just weak. But in researching the switch and c1s color checker workflow, I can’t imagine why such a common workflow might require 2 programs and a step like closing and reopening capture one but I’m not looking forward to it. Please reconsider taking action on this feature.

    0
  • Ferdi vd Sanden

    I'm with Damani about too much steps for ICC-ing.
    The pro requires good color with minimal steps from the key app in the workflow.
    It would really be amazing if C1P could team up with Calibrate and friends for a workflow,
    at least as near as Lightroom can go, that is keeping you at work rather than export tiff as neutral, import to calibrate, export as icc, close capture one, open capture one use ICC. 

    I'd really love a solution for this

    0
  • ninjatune

    It seems insane that they won't even look into this issue, when they tout themselves as the only professional choice in photographic software etc. 

    Yet a lot of their recent features seem to target the amateur photographer/lightroom user, and not their core base of working professionals, for whom a feature like this is hugely important and appealing to.

    A few of the previous solutions were 3 years ago, so I'm wondering what everyone does now to manage the lack of this feature. What are the work arounds since C1 seem completely disinterested after 14 years of people asking this question..

    1

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