DNG files not imported?

Comments

30 comments

  • Shane Baker

    Hi Thomas

    Obvious question: what version of C1 are you using?

     

    1
    Comment actions Permalink
  • SFA

    C1 expects to see DNG files with camera information embedded. 

    Not all revisions of DNG are supported as far as I understand things.

    It is possible that the DNG output from LR may be at a revision level that C1 does not support or that does not have the requisite identifying information to be supportable.

    Also if they happen to be B&W files that are not using RBG colour space there could be problems.

    The Release notes contain more information about file constraints that may or may not apply in your situation. It may be worth check them to assess whether they offer guidance about the situation you have found.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    Shane Baker,

    I'm on version 21 (14.0.2.49).

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Shane Baker

    I'm on version 21 (14.0.2.49).

    Ok. I'm on the same version and I can open DNG files created directly by a DJI drone and also, DNGs created by Adobe's DNG Converter from a Nikon Z6 II raw file.

    Bearing in mind SFA's comments above, why don't you convert a raw file to DNG using Adobe's free utility and see if C1 can open that? If they open, then the issue would seem to be with LR's conversion of your raw files.

     

     

     

     

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    SFA,

    Thank you for your reply.

    I simply don't understand how a program which is called "the industry standard" cannot read DNG files. My workflow has been "convert to DNG on import" in LR for as long as I can remember. Over 10 years at least. The files are unedited DNG's converted from NEF files in LR. I don't have program on my mac, which can not read the DNG. Finder, Photos, Luminar (4), Photo Mechanic (6) and everything else I've tried had no problems opening and previewing the files.

    I just don't get it, and right now I'm quite scared, because I used C1 to import my LR catalogs into C1. I did not double check to see if all files were imported, but yesterday when I made a few new catalogs, it was obvious, that C1 did import all files. Now I have to check everything again, to see if they are all imported :-/

    I made a shared folder in Dropbox with two DNG files. Can anyone try to see if they can get C1 to show the files? https://www.dropbox.com/sh/arwwviefgey6suu/AABBnQcJutpPME6zX1erSD4La?dl=0 Both images were shot on a Nikon D5000 about ten years ago. I'm not saying that C1 one is a bad program, but I've never encountered anything like this before.

    Thanks!

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Shane Baker

    I made a shared folder in Dropbox with two DNG files. Can anyone try to see if they can get C1 to show the files?

    Ok. I downloaded the two files and was able to view them in Apple Finder, Apple Preview and Affinity Photo v1.9 - but C1 couldn't see them.

    It seems to come back to SFA's comments: "C1 expects to see DNG files with camera information embedded.". Your DNG file has no information of any note. This is what Affinity Photo reveals:

    By comparison, this is what AP reports for one of my Z6 II raw files:

    I understand your frustration with C1, but at the same time, don't understand why LR would strip out all the camera data. 

    FWIW, it appears that Adobe's DNG Converter leaves all the EXIF data in place!

    All the best

    Shane

     

     

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber
    Apple Photos does see the camera in the EXIF data?And so does Photo Mechanics 6.
    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • SFA

    Which version of DNG does LR use by default when converting?

    Windows "Sketch and Snip" reports camera information but not lens information.

    The files, given their reported pixel dimensions, do seem to be quite small. Though not too small to be editable if the dimensions are correct.

    I think I would make the samples available to the C1 Support Team via a "Submit a request" Case and see what they have to say.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    You're right about the file size. That's very strange. Finder can read all meta data. Strange.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Keith R

    "I simply don't understand how a program which is called "the industry standard" cannot read DNG files."

    Because not all DNG files are the same.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    Keith R,

    That would make the whole purpose of DNG files meaningless.

    https://helpx.adobe.com/photoshop/digital-negative.html

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    SFA,

    Thanks. I think I'll have to dig deeper into this, and have to check up on all my archives and working catalogs. I just love spending time on tasks like these... not :-/

    Thanks.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • SFA

    Thomas,

    There have been several standards for DNG files over the years. I don't think Capture One has ever claimed to support all of them but what was being supported 10 years ago I cannot recall. I have never used DNG files seriously although a couple of my phones have produced them so that they can claim to offer RAW files.

    If LR does not give the same results on export as does the Adobe DNG converter then either the LR export has  (or had back in the day) some option for suppressing such data or storing it in a different place; or the "rules"  related to the "standard" have been flexibly applied.

    "Flexible" standards are a familiar feature of PDF files, for example, as anyone who has been involved with trying to extract data from them will probably have experienced. So there is no reason to expect other proprietory file types, put freely into the public domain, to have completely 'fixed' and fully policed output. 

    For companies the size of Apple and Microsoft (and Adobe) dealing, somehow, with every variant standard, no matter how rare it might be in the wild, is a small matter. For smaller companies things are different.

     

    Whether that comment applies here I cannot tell, but past experience with PDF files in certain business situations suggests it might be to some extent.

    It would still be best to get Capture One to take a look at samples of the problem files and offer some guidance.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    the problem is probably caused because the posted files miss the DNG specific information in the meta data !  

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Dave R

    I made the big mistake of converting many of my RAW files to DNG using Lightroom and regretted it. For. instance the DNG convertor truncates lens names in the metadata, CO is looking for full names in order to apply correction, can't find them and reverts to generic settings.  Luckily I had back ups of the original RAWs for most but not all of the converted images.  Lesson, if you must convert to DNG use the option to embed the original RAW.

    Dave

     

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    Dave,

    Most of my images are converted to DNG files (from 2002/2003 to 2019 I think), unfortunately. If I could do things over again, I would not do it, but that's life. Anyway. Thanks for all your input.

    😀

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    when I re export your files from LRC  the missing data is added and the files seems to work, before it was not even possible to open them in PS as raw !  what LR version are you using ? 

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    CSP,

    Was using. I stopped my Adobe subscription last year.

    Thanks.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Dave R

    More info on DNG from the help pages

    DNG files from camera models with native support in Capture One (such as Leica, Ricoh, and some others, see the camera support page) will per default have their native Capture One colors applied. Capture One Pro  / Enterprise / Cultural Heritage fully supports those native DNG files as any other RAW file format.

    Capture One Pro / Enterprise / Cultural Heritage also fully supports converted DNGs (RAW files of non-DNG format converted into DNG) that include the original RAW file. Note that those RAW files should originally come from the cameras that are already supported in Capture One.

    With Capture One Pro / Enterprise / Cultural Heritage, the DNG files from non-supported camera models will be displayed with a generic DNG profile. This opens up for great color profiling of all smartphones, drones, and camera models that capture in DNG format.

     

    NOTE: We do not support adjustments and settings from other applications embedded in DNG files.

     

     

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    Dave R,

    C1 may not claim to support DNG files, but as every obscure image software on the interwebs support DNG, I was under the assumption, that C1 also did. I had a look in my folders, and damn you Adobe, I got a lot of DNG files that under 1MB i filesize. That's a problem. I'm trying to do a deep scan recovery on my backup drives, to see if I got the files in the correct size with all data embedded. But sorting out 35K/650GB files with random generic filenames is a total pain in the behind 😬

    Thanks.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    hm, maybe this was to fast..  ;-)   the file info you see maybe also incorrect because when I open the re converted file it has 69mb ! 

    in general I think we have to many companies claiming DNG support but when you look closer they offer only limited compatibly like C1 which is misleading. 

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    CSP,

    What do you mean by re convert?

    Thanks.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    well when i open your original file in PS it does not trigger ACR, which is strange but the file size after opening is correct 4288 X 2848 8 bit, never seen something before. the file size in the finder is only 500kb which does not make sense.  but a DNG is in fact nothing else than a TIFF with some extras and as it opens without triggering ARC makes me believe this is maybe a compressed linear DNG file and not a RAW DNG. but I could not find a way to proof this.  anyway when I load you file in LRC and export the file as DNG  it starts to behave like expected but  this does not guaranty that it will work c1 too. 

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Keith R

    That would make the whole purpose of DNG files meaningless.

    Nothing about the fact that in practice there can be different "flavours" of DNG, in any way undermines Adobe's stated purposes for the format - "common format" does not mean "only one way to do it", and the DNG Specification document makes very clear:

    https://wwwimages2.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/products/photoshop/pdfs/dng_spec_1.5.0.0.pdf

     

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    CSP,

    I think I now know what triggered all this. The DNG files have been a trip around Google Photos at one time. The Nikon D5000 files are less than 16MP, so Google should not have many any fiddling with the files, but it seems Google has done so anyway. Maybe Google made their own sci-fi compression, that can turn a DNG into a fairy-file :-)

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    OK, seems this case can be considered solved - evil google is to blame 

    I think the files got converted to 8bit tiff with strong JPG compression but the file type was not changed accordingly, this also explains the rather small file size. the raw converter can not read them but PS opens them fine,  took me a while to understand this. 

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    @ Keith

    no, linear DNG is an great option and I guess most user who use them understand how they work. the only option to convert files direct to linear DNG is by using a custom setting in the adobe DNG converter so you can never accidentally use this format ! 

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    CSP,

    I downloaded a trial version of LRC and tried to open a DNG and save it as an DNG. Result = no preview in Apple Finder and Preview does not recognise the RAW format. When exported as JPG, they seem to be OK. Around 1.5-8 MB pr. file, which seems to be expected. So "all I have to do" now, is to import all the "Google DNG's" and export them again in JPG. I'm glad we have a pandemic, and nothing else better to do 😬

    Thanks!

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • CSP

    you are welcome, I would try to simply change the filetype from dng to tiff and test if c1 can read it but I fear it does not support tif with jpg compression,  preview opens it fine.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink
  • Thomas Schreiber

    CSP,

    I think I'll go with JPG type instead. It's more secure than DNG apparently :-) Thanks.

    0
    Comment actions Permalink

Please sign in to leave a comment.