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Since C1 11 installation duplication at each image import

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30 commentaires

  • NN636151752166318442UL
    http://fs5.directupload.net/images/180107/ij2zkwcn.jpg
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  • SFA
    It's very difficult to see but I think what you have there is an original image and an edited version of it and you are displaying both variants in the browser.

    If you see a number in the top right corner of the thumbnail - 1 and 2 for example (more are possible) that is what you have. If you click on the symbol in the top left corner the 2 images will "stack" to show just one image - whichever one you currently have as number 1.

    That is not something that would happen normally by just importing.

    Can you tell us some more about how you are working with Capture One?

    Also it looks like your "not correct" images have been "processed" to output. It would be interesting to understand when that happened.

    HTH.


    Grant
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Thank you very much SFA,

    for better understanding, I took picture sequences of my workflow:

    Step 1:

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/srg82hqe.jpg

    Raw picture on SD-card

    Step 2:

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/pgr563ec.jpg

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/w3sq47ko.jpg

    Picture import by C1

    Step 3:

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/zqaez6sv.jpg

    Now you see the 2 pictures generated by C1. On the left the naive picture, on the right side the processed picture. Sometimes thumbnail of the "processed" picture is wrong (shows a thumbnail of any previous picture).

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/2getjhn6.jpg

    On the hard drive, the correct RAW-picture was imported

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/44z85o5u.jpg

    The information of the left, right photo is correct indicating a Zeiss Vario-Tessar T* FE 24-70 mm

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/mhssn8uq.jpg

    The information of the right photo is not correcting indicating a wrong objective (Zeiss Batis 2.8/18 mm)

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180108/ssmqit9w.jpg

    The right photo was processed "automatically"

    I hope you can see that the "mistake" happens during import. 20 imported photos generates so at least 40 thumbnails. Can you solve the problem with this informations. I would be very happy. Thank you!
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  • SFA
    If you are importing a new image directly in to C1 V11 from an SD card the first thing that puzzles me is how you get an images with a C1 V10 process engine. (7th Image if I counted correctly)

    Have you at some point had images with the same file names imported in C1 V10?

    I could perhaps speculate about some other suggestions but I might be wasting your reading time unless we have an explanation for the V10 Engine in the duplicate image as part of the evidence to consider.

    This is not something I have seen before - but the I work mostly with Sessions and set the field names for the session on import. Before I started to name on import I recognised some possibility of name duplication but, in a session, that can be easily avoided with a little care. It may not be quite so easy working in a catalogue IF something happened somehow OUTSIDE the catalogue and C1.

    What can you tell us?


    Grant
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  • Noah Bershatsky
    I've had the same problem as the original poster as well. C1's catalog is a mess!
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    If you are importing a new image directly in to C1 V11 from an SD card the first thing that puzzles me is how you get an images with a C1 V10 process engine. (7th Image if I counted correctly)

    This is done by the programme itself. No idea how this can happen

    Have you at some point had images with the same file names imported in C1 V10?

    Indeed. C1 V10 already used same file names as C1 V11 now (see image).

    http://fs1.directupload.net/images/180109/ujb3gxlu.jpg

    I could perhaps speculate about some other suggestions but I might be wasting your reading time unless we have an explanation for the V10 Engine in the duplicate image as part of the evidence to consider.

    This is not something I have seen before - but the I work mostly with Sessions and set the field names for the session on import. Before I started to name on import I recognised some possibility of name duplication but, in a session, that can be easily avoided with a little care. It may not be quite so easy working in a catalogue IF something happened somehow OUTSIDE the catalogue and C1.

    You change the file names on import. Is that right?

    What can you tell us?


    Grant
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  • SFA
    Ok, so you in your example you had the same file name going through processing last year.

    What happened to the original file for that name?

    Where does the XMP appear from in your 2018 import? Is it the same file that is in the 2017 folder set?

    Is it anything to do with importig images from another application's catalogue?

    I will guess that it is and maybe explains the problem as you see it but not yet how the problem happens.

    Yes I name images on import adding prefix information but retaining the original file name as part of the name.

    For the prefix I mostly use some fixed text and some of the token naming options. The naming "convention" used depends on the nature of the shoot.


    Grant
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Ok, so you in your example you had the same file name going through processing last year.

    What happened to the original file for that name?

    Nothing. They are stored under year-month-day correctly on the hard drive.

    Where does the XMP appear from in your 2018 import? Is it the same file that is in the 2017 folder set?

    The XMP are diplayed for all samples of the picture correct, independently of C1 engine 10 or 11. It is not the same file than in 2017 (year/month/day). When I change import name like you proposed, the error still remains

    Is it anything to do with importig images from another application's catalogue?

    It doesnt matter if I import from another catalogue, SSD or SD card. The problem is always the same. What I did before updating from C1 10 to 11, was changing my SSD harddrive. I did a 1:1 copy on the new hard drive. But I think, this isn't an explanation for the problem. The original files are exactly the same

    I will guess that it is and maybe explains the problem as you see it but not yet how the problem happens.

    Yes I name images on import adding prefix information but retaining the original file name as part of the name.

    For the prefix I mostly use some fixed text and some of the token naming options. The naming "convention" used depends on the nature of the shoot.

    Thank you very much for this advice!
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Would the next update solve this problem or is a new installation of C1 11 required?
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN636151752166318442UL" wrote:
    Would the next update solve this problem or is a new installation of C1 11 required?


    As we have not yet identified the root cause of the apparent duplication then there is no honest answer to your question.

    If you have XMP file synching active AND XMP files from a previous time which relate to the same files name (at the point and time of importing) then that might be part of the problem. At least one could speculate that it might be. I am not aware of C1 using XMP files unless one of the synch method options is active.

    The problems looks more like Data than anything and so I would doubt that a re-install and no other work would resolve the potential for the problem.

    I would suggest you create a Support Case and seek technical assistance for the Capture One support team. At some point someone is going to have to get involved with sorting out the file system to prevent what looks like new images being associated with older image XMP files (and maybe other files) on import when names are not unique. But before doing that there is quite a lot to understand about what has happened and how.

    Meanwhile for all new images it would be wise make sure they are renamed to avoid duplication.

    If, on import, even renaming does not work to solve the problem the possibility is that the connection between the files is made early in the process before the renaming is applied.

    This suggests 2 things.

    Firstly the XMP files are for some reason "visible" to the import process when it would be better if they were not. They might, for example, by lying around in a temporary work area from which a process, perhaps a Windows process, should have cleared them from the system.

    Secondly if you are importing with the "Include Existing Adjustments" box ticked (Import window, bottom left hand corner. If you don't see it drag the window out a little until it appears). In your case this may not be an appropriate setting to use due to the potential for discovering "old" settings files from previous images with the same name.

    However I cannot be in any way sure of this without seeing into your system - that would be better to do working with the C1 Support team.


    HTH.


    Grant
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Thank you very much for your help and comment in detail.

    Unfotunately duplication of imported images doesn`t change when renaming them before. So I think you' re right that the connection between the files is made early in the process before renaming is applied.

    If this is a window process I would try to clear it instantly. But actually I have no idea how to do that.

    The box for "include existing adjustement" is not activated at import.

    I just contacted C1 support for help. If they can solve the problem, I'll report again.

    Thank you again for your great help!!!!
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  • Dave R
    Just had a similar experience, imported 25 new images and when previews built there were 4 previews of pictures imported months ago which I sent to recycle bin before I realized there was something amiss. I recovered them,rebuilt the previews and the pictures I had taken appeared. I am almost certain these problems are related to the new exclude duplicates function.

    For preview in the above read thumbnail. 🤭
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Thank you David for your comment. So I'm not the only one with this problem! 😕
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    23-01-2018 23:48
    Supporter


    Hi,

    I'm not sure that it will be fixed, though I definitely would like to narrow down the cause to have a fix.

    In the meantime, you can remove the extraneous variants by narrowing down the timeframe of the time (via the Filters tool) and selecting one of the second variants and selecting Choose By Same > Variant Position. Once those are selected, you can easily move them to the catalog trash.

    Best regards,

    Phase One Technical Support
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  • NN636151752166318442UL
    Sorry, unfortunately until we can decipher what's going on I'm afraid this will have to be done manually. Additionally, there's unlikely to be a retroactive fix as this variant information is stored inside the catalog and they appear to be normal variants, as if the user had created them on purpose.

    Best regards,

    Phase One Technical Support
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  • NN635302109069022300UL
    I have the same problem on import into a catalog with each file being duplicated. Appears to only occur if the file directory has been accessed by a previous session.
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN635302109069022300UL" wrote:
    I have the same problem on import into a catalog with each file being duplicated. Appears to only occur if the file directory has been accessed by a previous session.


    Only happens when you are importing from a folder that has a previously creates Capture One folder with Cache and Settings subfolders?

    Would that folder be from an earlier C1 version?

    If so do you end up with variants of the same file (same name) just as if you had created them that way by choice, each having a different processing engine related to the version in which they were created?

    Just a thought. Something to eliminate perhaps?


    Grant
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  • NN635302109069022300UL
    Hi Grant,
    The session folders imported from were accessed by previous versions of C1 and resulted in duplicates in the catalog.

    A new session created with the current C1 version appears not to cause this problem when imported into either an older catalog or a newly created one.

    Ken
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  • SFA
    OK.

    When there is an underlying engine change in C1 there is, as you have no doubt seen, a new folder established in a session's original source file folder an that holds the edits undertaken with the new version.

    There is an assumption that it is not a good idea to auto convert the image edits because when the engine changes the way things are processed tends to change as well.

    So anyone with old edits in a session keeps those edits by default but can choose to change them by upgrading to the new image. Or if you create a NEW edit VARIANT the new engine will always be used. If you clone a previously created variant the old engine will be retained.

    There are a few other files involved with that as well.

    So I would guess that C1, faced with imposting a session to a catalogue where the session folders have more than one set of edits from earlier versions AND the "include previous edits" option is adopted may take a cautious view and include everything it finds.

    If that is the case, in terms of what you can see looking at the Base Characteristics of the duplicated images, you may have found the reason for your duplication.

    Whether that is a reasonable thing to do is probably something that will divide opinion but assuming you find some evidence that support the theory you might want to describe it to the C1 team and discuss whether it is as intended and how it might be addressed differently.

    Bear in mind also that session folder can be access by more than one session (.cosessiondb) . I guess a reference Catalogue could also have a situation where more than one catalogue references the same files and there is certainly no reason why the same folder cannot be used as source files for both catalogues and sessions.

    All of which must make design considerations extremely interesting!


    As usual there is always the possibility that I am wrong and my summation of 2+2 have not arrived at the magic answer "4".


    Grant
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  • NN635302109069022300UL
    Thanks for your comments but I think all the import process has to do is import the images as last worked on and then give the option to update to the latest engine.

    However I have just imported a single directory folder and all images are duplicated and selecting an image in the browser displays a completely different image. Even some of the copies are of different images. Catalog verified OK. Re opened C1 and still same problem.

    I give up - the catalog system is not usable so will go back to Lightroom for its seachable catalog and better printing and only use C1 sessions for some edits.

    Ken
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  • SFA
    New catalogue or an existing old catalogue with images having the same names as you are importing?

    The verification can only check that the database structure seems sound and that files have what appear to be the correct required records with file names (or sometimes references to file names) to attach to.

    If the data is somehow not clean the catalogue may not be clean either.

    You really need to get someone - perhaps the Capture One Support Team - to help assess what has been happening.


    Grant
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  • NN635302109069022300UL
    When accessing new raw files via an old session all green grass turns to mush or green slime on magnification.
    Same thing happens with a new session, so it looks like you're right, I need to contact the Support Team!

    Ken
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN635302109069022300UL" wrote:
    When accessing new raw files via an old session all green grass turns to mush or green slime on magnification.
    Same thing happens with a new session, so it looks like you're right, I need to contact the Support Team!

    Ken


    Bright green?

    Focus mask on?

    Or have you just got a very low resolution result for some reason?
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  • NN635302109069022300UL
    No the focus mask is not on - seems as if C1 cannot decode green properly from an Olympus orf raw file which is underexposed by 1 -2 EV
    Lightroom can import and display OK so will send the file to the support team.

    Ken
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  • NNN636490182277118977
    I have the same problem. I tried the C1 10 Testversion befor, but it seems nothing to have to do with this.
    The copies are always with the same presets. Also the wrong thumbnails. They come from one order which was one of the first I did with the new c11.
    One thing i mentioned is, that i deleted the raw files from the order where the presets come from. It was a Party with very hard changes in the colors, so it is very easy to see.
    If I choose import to cataloge everything went ok, just if i choose actual place then there is always a copy of the imported File.
    Filenames and folders are definitly not the same.
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  • charles kasler
    I just imported from my camera & had several duplicates...never had that before. Also it imported into 2 session folders instead of the usual one.
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  • Ian Wilson
    [quote="Pareshk" wrote:
    I just imported from my camera & had several duplicates...never had that before. Also it imported into 2 session folders instead of the usual one.

    I have found in the past that if I have two sessions open it will import into both. (Usually I only have one session open at a time, but just occasionally I have two open, and forget, and it catches me out.)

    Ian
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  • NN635736471054336232UL
    I too have had the issue for a while, two copies, one with ridiculous settings/white balance/preview.
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  • mo3bius
    Hello,

    I have the same issue. If you import first the jpeg Version of your pictures and afterwards the RAW Version it will not create new Variants. It ist the only workaround I know...

    Since I upgraded form Version 9 I have many problems. For example c1 cant locate my pictures or say the files are corrupted although I entered the correct location on my HDD.



    have a nice day
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  • charles kasler
    my issue hasn't happened any more. Contact tech support if you haven't yet
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