Previews of all photos take too long

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52 commentaires

  • C-M-B
    Well I'd say the fix would be a faster drive and reducing the amount of photos per folder.
    If you have a partifuclary slow HDD and there are hundreds or thousands of photos in a folder, it will take a long time.

    I wish C1 would save thumbnails instead of reloading images every time you open it - but alas, that's not how it works.
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  • Robert Whetton
    [quote="NN636275244091231986UL" wrote:
    ..it can take 30-40 minutes to load the previews.
    Any way to fix it?

    What's the connection to the HDD, what brand of HDD is it?
    I use a USB3 caddy to read my drives (80-100MB/sec) and can work from it without any trouble.
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  • Levin
    I have exactly the same problem. I have broken my catalogs into calendar years to keep the size manageable. However even a years worth of photos for me is 3000 to 5000 images. When I open a year catalog, it can take 30 mins to load. If I use the search function, say 4 star or higher images, it can take 40 to 60 minutes. This is becoming unacceptable.

    I also use another program called ON1 RAW 2019, and it can load all my thumbnails from my entire collection (20,000 plus images) in less than 5 secs. Lightroom will also load a year of photos in about 2 to 3 seconds. One thing On1 suggests for optimum performance is to place the Browse Cache on a highspeed SSD. I can't find a way to do this with C1 or know if this is even possible.

    Any suggestions on speeding this up?
    Levin
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  • Ian Leslie
    Wow, that's bad. I am currently discussing the performance of displaying my catalogue's all images collection with support. My problems are no where near as bad as that. Have you opened a support case?
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  • C-M-B
    The problem is that Capture One does not save any thumbnails or previews - it only fetches the previews of the files when you open the session/catalog.
    That works for very fast drives (like SSDs) with a small(ish) number of photos, but as soon as your drive is slightly slower (like a HDD drive or a NAS drive) or there is a larger number of files involved (a few hundred or thousand) this doesn't work as well any more.

    The advantage is that sessions and cataloges are small when compared to a Lightroom catalog and they open fast - but then the images take a long time to load.

    On a sidenote: with Mac OSX this is not an issue, there the preview files are always kept due to the way the file system works (or something to that effect according to support). However I think preview files should be kept (at least small, compressed thumbnails) and images should only be (re)loaded when clicking on them.
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  • Darryl Brooks
    Yeah, I think this might be a deal breaker for me, at least until I get a new computer with SSD. It is ridiculous that the program needs to reload all the images every time you click on a folder. I tried C1 because I had heard it was faster and better than LR. It may be better, but it's unusable because of the speed issues. I'm not going to change my structure because the software doesn't work the way it should. It's supposed to be for professional photographers, so having a folder with 40k images in it shouldn't be unusual.

    I just waited 20 minutes for the program to settle down so I could filter on and export an image. I clicked to the export folder to check on it, went back to the main folder, and now I am waiting another 20 minutes. Meanwhile, I've gone into Lightroom and gotten the job done.

    It's not slow because I don't have an SSD. It's slow because it is doing a ridiculous amount of unnecessary work every time I click on the folder. The SSD just allows the ridiculous amount of work to be done faster. I waited 20 hours for previews to be built that aren't being used. I'm through waiting on Capture One so I can do my work.
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  • SFA
    [quote="DBVirago2" wrote:
    Yeah, I think this might be a deal breaker for me, at least until I get a new computer with SSD. It is ridiculous that the program needs to reload all the images every time you click on a folder. I tried C1 because I had heard it was faster and better than LR. It may be better, but it's unusable because of the speed issues. I'm not going to change my structure because the software doesn't work the way it should. It's supposed to be for professional photographers, so having a folder with 40k images in it shouldn't be unusual.

    I just waited 20 minutes for the program to settle down so I could filter on and export an image. I clicked to the export folder to check on it, went back to the main folder, and now I am waiting another 20 minutes. Meanwhile, I've gone into Lightroom and gotten the job done.

    It's not slow because I don't have an SSD. It's slow because it is doing a ridiculous amount of unnecessary work every time I click on the folder. The SSD just allows the ridiculous amount of work to be done faster. I waited 20 hours for previews to be built that aren't being used. I'm through waiting on Capture One so I can do my work.


    The previews are used but C1 will load them into memory from disk. In addition, depending on various settings, including the preview size you have elected to use vs. your screen resolution as a starting point and then whether or not you are using Proofing and a number of other factors, the preview may need to be discarded in favour of showing a freshly calculated version of the image rather than some sort of attempt to show you how things look based on the reduced size preview.

    Are you seeing a lot of disk activity due to memory swapping. If your system has less than about 12Gb of free memory (assuming you are not running anything else placing huge demands on memory as well) you might see a lot of swapping going on. However there are so many variables involved that no single piece of random advice is likely to be decisively useful.

    I would suggest you create a Support Case and have the Support team take a look at the log files to see if they can spot a known problem pattern that explains what you are seeing.

    40 seconds would be probably average. 40 minutes is ridiculous since it should be possible to work with files even if the system has not finished preparing its working memory space as it is trying to do with a view to taking a little set up time on load in order to make the editing experience positive given the amount of work it will likely be undertaking during that part of process.

    HTH.

    Grant
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  • Thomas Demmelmaier
    I'll never understand that there are still people who still don't have SSDs after 10 years of their introduction. Or that people use a raw converter as image management software.

    Or they arrive with their 10 year old labtops and try to use software that is optimized for multiple cores.

    If it takes too long then buy you a pc with which it goes fast, I have to and yes it's expensive if you want to get even faster but that's why you go to work.

    I had to let that out now because it annoys me so much. sorry.
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  • Darryl Brooks
    Thank you. That was helpful.
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  • Ian Leslie
    [quote="SFA" wrote:
    I would suggest you create a Support Case and have the Support team take a look at the log files to see if they can spot a known problem pattern that explains what you are seeing.

    40 seconds would be probably average. 40 minutes is ridiculous since it should be possible to work with files even if the system has not finished preparing its working memory space as it is trying to do with a view to taking a little set up time on load in order to make the editing experience positive given the amount of work it will likely be undertaking during that part of process.


    This is good advice. I am not experiencing the same issue you have - once my large collection has been displayed once filtering and changing the filter is fast. Switching away and back is not prefect but not a full wait once I have paid it the first time.

    Your situation seems worse that mine and I am deep into a discussion with support.
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  • Ian Leslie
    [quote="Tom-D" wrote:
    I'll never understand that there are still people who still don't have SSDs after 10 years of their introduction.


    LOL I have over 2Gb of images to manage. It was only a short time ago that SSDs were even available that size. My next machine will probably have the ability to work on new shoots from an SSD and the main library on the HD. But come on man even if you bought a new machine today those of us using C1 for our library would still not put all our images on an SSD.

    [quote="Tom-D" wrote:
    Or that people use a raw converter as image management software.

    That *is* what catalogues are for.

    [quote="Tom-D" wrote:
    Or they arrive with their 10 year old labtops and try to use software that is optimized for multiple cores.

    If it takes too long then buy you a pc with which it goes fast, I have to and yes it's expensive if you want to get even faster but that's why you go to work.


    Well sure - to a point. If the software is querying or managing memory poorly you can throw new faster hardware at the problem and it will help but in the end the software is still not living up to its potential. I think we should be helping C1 find the kinks and work them out.

    That way future versions will just scream on your super fast rig. 😊

    [quote="Tom-D" wrote:
    I had to let that out now because it annoys me so much. sorry.


    Same 😄
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  • Darryl Brooks
    Can I get opinions on this laptop?

    Primarily for Capture One and Lightroom

    Processor & Memory:

    - Intel® Core™ i7-8750H Processor 2.2GHz
    - 32GB DDR4 2666MHz RAM
    Drives:

    - 1TB M.2 PCIe Solid State Drive
    - No Optical Drive
    Operating System:

    - Microsoft® Windows 10 Home (64-bit)
    Graphics & Video:

    - 15.6" Touchscreen InfinityEdge Anti-Reflective 4K Ultra HD (3840 x 2160) Display
    - 4GB NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 1050 Ti Graphics
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  • SFA
    [quote="DBVirago2" wrote:
    Can I get opinions on this laptop?

    Primarily for Capture One and Lightroom

    Processor & Memory:

    - Intel® Core™ i7-8750H Processor 2.2GHz
    - 32GB DDR4 2666MHz RAM
    Drives:

    - 1TB M.2 PCIe Solid State Drive
    - No Optical Drive
    Operating System:

    - Microsoft® Windows 10 Home (64-bit)
    Graphics & Video:

    - 15.6" Touchscreen InfinityEdge Anti-Reflective 4K Ultra HD (3840 x 2160) Display
    - 4GB NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 1050 Ti Graphics


    Who is making the bits that link them all together?
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  • Darryl Brooks
    Dell
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  • SFA
    [quote="DBVirago2" wrote:
    Dell


    I have a 6 year old Precision M4700.

    At this level Dell seem to make a very capable product that is also extremely strong.

    The only thing I have had to replace so far is the charger and that was because I allowed it to slip off my lap for the umpteenth time and it caught the charger connector plug in such a way that it broke the plug. Unlikely to be very reliable if repaired so I changed the charger as the cable is integral.

    I have 24Gb RAM, an extra 1Tb SSD as the data drive running in a Sata 2 speed comms card slot (it still seems fast enough). The disk are quite full and I am usually running several other applications. The ancient Nvidia Quadro GPU does not have a significant effect but is used for some things.

    I'm guessing if they are delivering with Win 10 Home it's not a Precision although the screen may well be the same as offered on the Precision. Mine is the smaller 1920x1080 Ultrasharp screen of those times.It's fine. It would be interesting to see what the 100% colour gamut of the 4k screen offers but apart from that the 4 k screen seems a little pointless (to me) at 15" size.

    Chosen carefully the latest models of Precision at the equivalent level seem to offer the option to install multiple SSDs but the battery size can make a difference in the amount of internal space available and the types of drives that can be installed. Also 4 memory slots, user upgradable.

    As you have probably worked out by now I have been extremely impressed by mine other than the 2 keys on the keyboard where the key top identifying decals have rubbed through. But I guess that's the way I rest my left hand rather than anything else!

    If it's within reach of your budget I would check out the Business section. Or maybe the business section of the Outlet operation?

    There is, of course, no certainty that my experience is typical not that, 6 years on and in different times, the products are on a par. But I think in general they are a fairly safe bet once you feel comfortable with any web forum comments and reviews you might feel a need to read.

    HTH.


    Grant
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  • Thomas Demmelmaier

    Well sure - to a point. If the software is querying or managing memory poorly you can throw new faster hardware at the problem and it will help but in the end the software is still not living up to its potential. I think we should be helping C1 find the kinks and work them out.

    That way future versions will just scream on your super fast rig. 😊


    I work on that all the time. 12.0.2 is such a performance version.
    12.0.1 needed 400 GB Ram to copy styles to 700 pictures.
    At 12.0.2 there were only 50% of it left.

    You can speed up HDDs with SSDs with an Auto Tier software.
    The software takes over the management and moves the files to the SSDs that are often used or are up to date.
    I've got a software like this in testing in our photo studio right now.

    Most HDDs in labtops are 5400 rpm hard drives, these are very slow.

    If HDD then I only use Enterprise stuff.

    *I think we should be helping C1 find the kinks and work them out. * <--- yea, seems like we have a Multicore Overhead, a 32 Core CPU is slower than a 5 ghz 8 Core Cpu. But that was 12.0.1, i don't know how i looks like now i don't have that 32 Core.
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  • NNN636892422939686172
    How do 6 core chips stack up against 8 core chips? Just curious as I'm building a new PC soon.
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  • Rob DuMont
    Might be a duplicate suggestion because some of the posts above were too long for me to read completely. I have an SSD for primary use but archive to regular HDD and performance is reasonable - slower yes, 40 minutes slow no. I never use Catalogues, only Sessions, so this may or may not be helpful to you (apologies if the latter)

    Try:
    - making your preview image smaller (Edit - Preferences - Image)
    - delete the preview images from the folder structure (Sessions only?), OR, right-click "regenerate previews"
    (In Sessions, previews are in /CaptureOne/Cache/Proxies/*.cop. I think that Catalogues store previews in the database, which might need repairing - see your File menu for that command)

    Your performance sounds abnormal and as others have suggested you could also create a support ticket.

    best of luck!
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  • Darryl Brooks
    Thanks. Your reply reminds me of this post. Since posting, I have bought a new laptop with i8 6 core processor and a 1Tb SSD along with 32Gb RAM. Since then, no software, including Capture One or Lightroom has been slow doing anything. I'm sure as I get used to it, that waiting 7 seconds will seem long, but right now, I'm loving it.
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  • Paul Gardner
    For those with slow computers try "PrimoCache". The more memory you have the better it works. I have 32Gb but 64 or 128 works better. I'm getting 10,000+ read/write from my NVMe's YMMV. Computer is an Asus Z170-WS@4.0Ghz. system is on C drive Samsung 970Pro NVMe, Images are on 2 each two TB NVMe's mounted in a Startec NVMe to plugin card.
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN637018153505220776UL" wrote:
    It's not slow because I don't have an SSD. It's slow because it is doing a ridiculous amount of unnecessary work every time I click on the folder. The SSD just allows the ridiculous amount of work to be done faster. I waited 20 hours for previews to be built that aren't being used. I'm through waiting on Capture One so I can do my work.


    Do you have any evidence you can share - especially about your configuration and what you are expecting to happen.

    Without any background to what you are working with in hardware terms or even what you have done so far with C1 all you offer is a rant of some kind.

    Glad you got that off your chest but it doesn't move things on offer no useful information to anyone, least of all you since no one could begin to offer any specific guidance.

    I would guess that your apparent experience is untypical but that is only a guess due to lack of useful information.
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  • Juan Stevens
    We all know his experience isn't untypical. Try not to get on him because he's expressing his frustration. I'm a long time user and I have the same frustrations. These performance issues have been happening for a long time now. If you look at the longest threads in this forum, they are all performance related. The mac version doesn't suffer these problems. And contacting support doesn't really help the issue. My machine has higher specs than most and I still have to sit and wait 30 min for my catalog to load. It's something i try and do in the mornings so that I can work through the day. Yes I have a lot of images in my catalog. I have multiple catalogs and it still takes forever. Bottom line is we are professionals. We have a lot of images. No other software has these issues. Phase one should fix it. They don't even have these issues with their other platform. And I know others(devs) try to blame it on the PC version being written on .net. Don't even get me started with that. When I start Capture one, it accesses the directories with my RAW images. If the previews are already generated, why does it have to check every RAW image?
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  • SFA
    [quote="NNN636568338569090854" wrote:
    Try not to get on him because he's expressing his frustration.


    Possibly so but it seems odd that the original post of Aug 19th at 11:44am seems to have been edited on 20th August and a link added in the middle of the text.

    People may need to stop and think before ranting (for whatever ultimate purpose) and consider that whilst they may feel they have a big problem and may well be right to feel frustration, most people do not. That suggests the problem is not all pervasive and so pointing an accusing finger in one direction is probably not appropriate. Or was not really the purpose of the post in the first place.
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  • Wesley
    [quote="SFA" wrote:
    [quote="NNN636568338569090854" wrote:
    Try not to get on him because he's expressing his frustration.


    Possibly so but it seems odd that the original post of Aug 19th at 11:44am seems to have been edited on 20th August and a link added in the middle of the text.

    People may need to stop and think before ranting (for whatever ultimate purpose) and consider that whilst they may feel they have a big problem and may well be right to feel frustration, most people do not. That suggests the problem is not all pervasive and so pointing an accusing finger in one direction is probably not appropriate. Or was not really the purpose of the post in the first place.

    It's just some bot that copy and pasted a portion of an earlier post: viewtopic.php?p=153776#p153776

    😂
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  • Juan Stevens
    [quote="SFA" wrote:
    [quote="NNN636568338569090854" wrote:
    Try not to get on him because he's expressing his frustration.


    Possibly so but it seems odd that the original post of Aug 19th at 11:44am seems to have been edited on 20th August and a link added in the middle of the text.

    People may need to stop and think before ranting (for whatever ultimate purpose) and consider that whilst they may feel they have a big problem and may well be right to feel frustration, most people do not. That suggests the problem is not all pervasive and so pointing an accusing finger in one direction is probably not appropriate. Or was not really the purpose of the post in the first place.


    He's expressing a frustration that quite a few posters in this forum have shared including myself. What is the purpose for getting on him for expressing that frustration. Maybe him and others feel that the only way for these issues to be worked on is for phase one to see these frustrations. If others don't have these issue and frustrations then great for them. Then they're happy and can continue. But I don't see how someone who doesn't have these frustrations should get on someone who does. Many of the people who have these frustrations love the product but have pain points. It seems correcting these pain points would create a better product even for those who don't share the same creative workflow as yourself.
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  • C-M-B
    [quote="NN637018153505220776UL" wrote:
    It's not slow because I don't have an SSD. It's slow because it is doing a ridiculous amount of unnecessary work every time I click on the folder. The SSD just allows the ridiculous amount of work to be done faster tellsubway. I waited 20 hours for previews to be built that aren't being used. I'm through waiting on Capture One so I can do my work.



    Absolutely correct.

    Capture One takes an obscene amount of read activity to load a regular session or catalog and even on a fast drive it takes way longer than similar programs.

    Using stuff like "PrimoCache" is just a way to work around bad programming and does not mean the computer is slow by any means.
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  • SFA
    [quote="C-M-B" wrote:
    [quote="NN637018153505220776UL" wrote:
    It's not slow because I don't have an SSD. It's slow because it is doing a ridiculous amount of unnecessary work every time I click on the folder. The SSD just allows the ridiculous amount of work to be done faster tellsubway. I waited 20 hours for previews to be built that aren't being used. I'm through waiting on Capture One so I can do my work.



    Absolutely correct.

    Capture One takes an obscene amount of read activity to load a regular session or catalog and even on a fast drive it takes way longer than similar programs.

    Using stuff like "PrimoCache" is just a way to work around bad programming and does not mean the computer is slow by any means.


    Or maybe something from the strange link that was added the day after the post was made?
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  • C-M-B
    The strange link does not matter (not sure what you're talking about).

    What matters is that the people at Capture One get their act together and fix this. This has been going on forever and it's quite embarassing when you compare the performance on a Mac and the performance on a Windows computer.
    I'm not sure whether this is because the programmers are inept or whether PhaseOne has a special contract with Apple, preventing them from developing the Capture Pilot App for Android and preventing them from improving the load performance on a NAS on a Windows computer...but either way, it sucks.
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  • SFA
    [quote="C-M-B" wrote:
    The strange link does not matter (not sure what you're talking about).



    Probably not now the original posts have been removed.
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  • Robert Whetton
    [quote="C-M-B" wrote:

    I'm not sure whether this is because the programmers are inept or whether PhaseOne has a special contract with Apple, preventing them from developing the Capture Pilot App for Android

    It's all about the user base with mobile apps, it takes a lot more effort to produce something on Android because of all the different configurations floating about. And apparently more photographers use iOS vs Android?
    The web version of CP works fine on my Nexus 10 btw 😊
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