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Session help

Alan Disler
I could use some guidance on the use of Sessions.

I use the MacOS filing system to catalogue my photos in the User>Pictures Folder and for now prefer to keep that system, which I guess means I am going to use COP8 Sessions.

It then was my understanding (perhaps incorrectly) that Session folders were virtual folders existing only within COP8 which pointed to the files I selected when I created the Session, leaving the original files untouched. What I have found is that the Session folders are actually created in the MacOS hierarchy as well and contain copies of the files I want to work with in addition to a folder of pointer files and adjustment files, which I thought were the only files to actually be created.

Is there a way to avoid the duplication of files when creating a Session or am I using Sessions incorrectly?

Thanks,

-Alan D.
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  • SFA
    I'm not sure if there is anything specifically different about the Mac functionality compared to Windows (which is what I use) but assume there is not for your purpose there are 2 considerations for sessions.

    You can access any folder from a Session and edit the relevant image files without duplicating them. The files can be on any media including, for example, the original memory card to which they were written if you so choose - although I normally would not do that.

    If you IMPORT the files, from the memory card of course but also if they already reside on your disk systems somewhere, a copy of the source file will be created. During import you have options to rename the files to something perhaps more useful that the camera provides, to say where you want them to be stored as untouched source files other than renamed, to say where you might like to back them up at the same time and if you so choose, to apply some preferred default adjustments to them as part of the import process.

    Within a session you can address both imported files (the folders they have been imported to will usually be visible as "Favourites" and non-imported files. The non-imported file locations can also be established as "Favourite locations" or just accessed and then forgotten using the "System Folders" section (on a Win machine - I assume something the same the same on a Mac.)

    HTH.



    Grant
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  • Alan Disler
    I see my mistake, thank you Grant. Once creating the Session, I imported the files I wanted to edit into the Session, rather than navigating to the files using the Session browser.

    Big help. Thanks.

    -Alan D.
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN635465205411689233UL" wrote:
    I see my mistake, thank you Grant. Once creating the Session, I imported the files I wanted to edit into the Session, rather than navigating to the files using the Session browser.

    Big help. Thanks.

    -Alan D.


    The import approach can have some advantages - for example it would free up the original files (albeit with their original names) to be moved to a safe backup somewhere whilst potentially doing a lot of your processing work whilst it operates.

    We don't have to choose and approach so it is quite possible to try both and see what feels the most comfortable over time. I use both according to needs (and sometimes laziness or impatience when I want to see some instant results for a few files!)

    Grant
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  • Alan Disler
    Yeah, but I already backup every night and also have Time Machine running. I also will prbly ingest, keyword, and rate in another program before I use COP8 to edit.

    -Alan D.
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  • Alan Disler
    So having decided to keep my User>Pictures hierarchy intact on my home drive for the time being, and using sessions I am finding little discussion about populating a session with a folder or files already imported on my drive.

    Am I correct that merely navigating to the files in question doesn't save them to the session, one apparently has to select and drag to the select folder?

    Thanks,

    Alan D.
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  • SFA
    I think it should be assumed that any folder you have accessed will be known to the Session should you access it again - with or without edits since C1 will, afaik, seek to add some thumbnails.

    However if you feel you really want to associate a folder with a session (on a non-exclusive basis) then browse in the C1 Library under System folders to find the folder, right click on it and then Add it as a Favourite. It will then appear in the session favourites at the top of the library making access to it easier in the future. (Unless you add thousands of favourites of course! A useful name probably helps.)

    I don't think the Select folder drag is necessarily what you want to do, though I suppose it might work in some instances. However does it not actually move the folder in the folder structure? Might not be what you are seeking to achieve if so.

    HTH.


    Grant
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  • Alan Disler
    Grant, thanks.

    Like I said, I'm just flailing about with sessions since I can't find any real documentation other than import situations, which I am not interested in. I will try your suggestion.

    In a nutshell, all I want to do is work on a certain number of files already in my system by creating a session that I can come back to at any time and find the same files there without having large, duplicate files all over the place and having to navigate to those files every time..

    Thanks,
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  • SFA
    Hi Alan,

    IMO adding the required folder(s) as favourites to your session(s) as required will be the easiest way to making them available from within your existing folder structure.

    Basically you are doing exactly what you might do through the system browser but the C1 session will build a record as a sort of "bucket" to keep things together. However there is not really much to document about the process over and above how the underlying operating system works.

    I would not advise using the Select folder feature for your purposes since that will "move" the file out of its original folder into the Selects folder in the session folder structure.

    HTH.



    Grant
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  • Alan Disler
    Grant,

    It seems to me that I can only bring a complete folder into a session, and not selected images? Do I need to bring in the entire folder, then delete certain images? For example, if I just want to work on one image.

    Thanks,

    -Alan D.
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    Hi Alan,

    You are correct. Sessions are folder based.
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  • Alan Disler
    Thank you. And how do I delete a session? Can't find that bit of info anywhere.

    -Alan D.
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    From Finder.
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  • Alan Disler
    Really? No way within COP8 to delete a session. Strange since I seem to be able to delete Finder folders from within COP8, and without alert message, I might add.

    OK, thanks.

    -Alan D.
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    Well, there is a way from CO8, which is Mac only, by the way.

    In the Edit menu you can find a Delete/Move to Trash item. When you first select the session's main folder from the Library, next go Edit > Move to Trash and click Delete in the warning dialog, you have removed a session from within CO8.

    The Trash is the System Trash, not any session trash, when you use this command.

    Note that you can accidentally delete a session that is currently open with this method. CO8 won't warn you about it, but when it wants to close the session it is not able to do so (not a big deal, I think).
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  • SFA
    [quote="NN635465205411689233UL" wrote:
    Grant,

    It seems to me that I can only bring a complete folder into a session, and not selected images? Do I need to bring in the entire folder, then delete certain images? For example, if I just want to work on one image.

    Thanks,

    -Alan D.


    Alan,

    If you are just linking to a folder it is not part of the session folder structure - just a link to wherever it is currently stored when you link to it.

    If you import it it becomes part of the session folder structure (usually) and you will (usually) be creating copies of the files. That means that you can manage, move, whatever, the entire session as a single entity which may be useful. However if you are just referencing files that may be used by other applications and perhaps managed by them you would not really want the new session to take over management of the files and folders concerned.

    For the same reasons if you link to a folder and leave it as external to the session folder I can't see any reason to delete files that you do not intend to process n C1.

    On the other hand if the entire folder and whatever contents you wish to keep are only ever going to be part of the something to do with the C1 session (so far as you know at the time) then copying (or moving) the folder into the session folder structure and (if you so choose) deleting unwanted files would be fine and an alternative to running an import to create the folder/files and then deleting the original folder.

    Of course, in effect, they are both achieving the same result but by a slightly different method.

    There is no right and wrong approach here, only what suits you best and makes you feel most comfortable. It may feel a little odd at first if you are coming from a different controlled philosophy OR a totally uncontrolled approach but if you work with it for a while the logic and potential benefits should become clear.


    HTH.


    Grant
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  • Alan Disler
    [quote="Paul_Steunebrink" wrote:
    Well, there is a way from CO8, which is Mac only, by the way.

    In the Edit menu you can find a Delete/Move to Trash item. When you first select the session's main folder from the Library, next go Edit > Move to Trash and click Delete in the warning dialog, you have removed a session from within CO8.

    The Trash is the System Trash, not any session trash, when you use this command.

    Note that you can accidentally delete a session that is currently open with this method. CO8 won't warn you about it, but when it wants to close the session it is not able to do so (not a big deal, I think).


    Paul,

    I must be way off base because I do not see Edit>Delete/Move to Trash option when I have a session open and I don't know what is meant by "session's main folder". The session folders under the session are: Capture, Selects,Output, and Trash. Then session Albums Five Stars, and All Images, then System folders.

    FYI my MO so far has been to create a test session, navigate in Library to the MacOS location of a folder In Pictures, and call it a favorites and work on selected images. Since I am in purely test mode I do not want these test sessions to be permanent.

    And I certainly know from within COP8 you can delete a folder from the MacOS hierarchy outside of COP8 because I have done it and that IS a big deal, with all due respect.

    Still muddling along in trial mode,

    -Alan D.
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  • Alan Disler
    Alan,

    If you are just linking to a folder it is not part of the session folder structure - just a link to wherever it is currently stored when you link to it.

    If you import it it becomes part of the session folder structure (usually) and you will (usually) be creating copies of the files. That means that you can manage, move, whatever, the entire session as a single entity which may be useful. However if you are just referencing files that may be used by other applications and perhaps managed by them you would not really want the new session to take over management of the files and folders concerned.

    For the same reasons if you link to a folder and leave it as external to the session folder I can't see any reason to delete files that you do not intend to process n C1.

    On the other hand if the entire folder and whatever contents you wish to keep are only ever going to be part of the something to do with the C1 session (so far as you know at the time) then copying (or moving) the folder into the session folder structure and (if you so choose) deleting unwanted files would be fine and an alternative to running an import to create the folder/files and then deleting the original folder.

    Of course, in effect, they are both achieving the same result but by a slightly different method.

    There is no right and wrong approach here, only what suits you best and makes you feel most comfortable. It may feel a little odd at first if you are coming from a different controlled philosophy OR a totally uncontrolled approach but if you work with it for a while the logic and potential benefits should become clear.


    HTH.


    Grant[/quote]

    Grant,

    I think that for now I only want to work on images in referenced mode, staying in the MacOS hierarchy i already have, but would definitely keep the sessions intact pretty much indefinitely, especially as i like to go back to images as I learn new techniques and become more proficient with the application.

    For that matter, couldn't I create a number of sessions mirroring my MacOS file structure, which would allow me too work on the images but leave them physically in place?

    Thyanks,

    -Alan D.
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  • SFA
    Alan,

    Session are effectively always in reference mode as far as the original source file are concerned. The only question is whether the files and folders sit under the session folder somewhere or have their own locations outside that C1 created collection of folders.

    If they sit within the session you can manage/move the entire session as a unit more easily (IMO). Importing files will, usually but not exclusively since you can over ride the suggestion, bring the source within the C1 session header folder and allow some other things to be done in connection with the files as a batch activity. But you are not forced to work that way if you choose not to.

    I chose not to use the C1 session folder structure concept at first but some month down the road realised that I could save time and effort by letting C1 establish its structure. My original fear had been that legacy files and edits from other applications (not catalog based applications) would be difficult but in fact of course that was not the case.

    I think in concept there is no reason why you should not add an "umrella" session folder to a group of existing structured folders if you wish to.

    You certainly don't need to do that for C1 to work but if you found it useful to do so for the purpose of managing the session then I see no reason not to do it. (I'm not familiar with Macs but assume that for this sort of thing there is no technical restriction to mess things up. Pretty sure it would be fine using Windows.)



    HTH.



    Grant
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    [quote="NN635465205411689233UL" wrote:
    [quote="Paul_Steunebrink" wrote:
    Well, there is a way from CO8, which is Mac only, by the way.

    In the Edit menu you can find a Delete/Move to Trash item. When you first select the session's main folder from the Library, next go Edit > Move to Trash and click Delete in the warning dialog, you have removed a session from within CO8.

    The Trash is the System Trash, not any session trash, when you use this command.

    Note that you can accidentally delete a session that is currently open with this method. CO8 won't warn you about it, but when it wants to close the session it is not able to do so (not a big deal, I think).


    Paul,

    I must be way off base because I do not see Edit>Delete/Move to Trash option when I have a session open and I don't know what is meant by "session's main folder". The session folders under the session are: Capture, Selects,Output, and Trash. Then session Albums Five Stars, and All Images, then System folders.

    Alan,

    Perhaps an screen dump helps:

    http://i1106.photobucket.com/albums/h366/Paul_S57/CO8Mac-Edit-Trash_zpsb82c643e.png

    About the session's main folder: that is what you described as the parent folder that contains the session folders (Capture, Selects and so on).
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  • Alan Disler
    Paul, I see we have a slight semantic issue.

    What you have shown me is a way to delete a folder in my OS system hierarchy by drilling down in the Library tool past what I refer to as COP8 into the System folders which in my mind is outside COP8. I NOW get that the Library tool is a "filtered" file browser that recognizes ONLY folders, COP8 files, and images. But while a COP8 session cannot be "moved to Trash" without a warning message, OS system files can be "moved to Trash" without ANY warning. To me, that is a serious lapse that needs to be corrected, especially for new users. Also, I think that "Move to Trash" is an inartful way to describe deleting a session from within COP8. "Deleting" implies doing away with something that is no longer needed. "Moving to Trash" is for getting rid of mistakes. "Delete Session" should be an option on the Menu bar, with a drop-down of all sessions COP8 knows about. Just my opinion.

    Thanks,

    -Alan D.
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