How To Turn off Lens Distortion?
I have been testing version 9 and today I noticed that one of my photos seemed to be missing some of the information at the bottom of the image. After a minute or two I realized that the image portion was missing due to the auto Lens Adjustment having been set. I ran the slider back to 0 and found my missing image data but I wondered why it had been auto adjusted. I had not asked that it be applied.
So I created a new catalog, specifically turned off Auto Adjust and loaded some images. The Lens Distortion was applied, but I expected that since the Auto Adjust was only set to do Exposure, HDR and Levels. I next unchecked the Hide Distorted Area and again ran the slider back to 0, Exited and created another new catalog. Same problem. The Hide Distorted Area remained unchecked, but the slider was up at about 80% and part of my image was still missing.
Regardless of what I seem to do C1 automatically applies the lens distortion adjustment and I lose part of my photo. Often this may be helpful as some of my UWA lenses really need the adjustment, but is there any way to configure C1 so that the lens distortion does not get applied when a new catalog is created? If so, how? I know I can manually turn it off for all of the images by copying and pasting, but is there some way to do this during import?
So I created a new catalog, specifically turned off Auto Adjust and loaded some images. The Lens Distortion was applied, but I expected that since the Auto Adjust was only set to do Exposure, HDR and Levels. I next unchecked the Hide Distorted Area and again ran the slider back to 0, Exited and created another new catalog. Same problem. The Hide Distorted Area remained unchecked, but the slider was up at about 80% and part of my image was still missing.
Regardless of what I seem to do C1 automatically applies the lens distortion adjustment and I lose part of my photo. Often this may be helpful as some of my UWA lenses really need the adjustment, but is there any way to configure C1 so that the lens distortion does not get applied when a new catalog is created? If so, how? I know I can manually turn it off for all of the images by copying and pasting, but is there some way to do this during import?
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Have you tried to set the sliders back (i.e. 0) and save a user preset from the lens tool, and then apply this preset during import?
Just a quick and dirty idea, I don't have an explanation for the behaviour you desribed.
cheers
BeO0 -
[quote="BeO" wrote:
Have you tried to set the sliders back (i.e. 0) and save a user preset from the lens tool, and then apply this preset during import?
I was so busy looking for a Preferences Setting or some UI command that would do that and I never thought about using a preset. I tried it - created a preset with only lens distortion set (to 0) and hiding the distorted area - and then created a new catalog. It all worked, so that takes care of this problem. Thank you very much.
Even so, I do wonder if there is some other way to do it.0 -
You should be able to set default settings for each tool
http://help.phaseone.com/en/CO8/Optimiz ... tings.aspx0 -
[quote="sizzlingbadger" wrote:
You should be able to set default settings for each tool
http://help.phaseone.com/en/CO8/Optimiz ... tings.aspx
Could not do it by camera, but I was able to set it as the default for all imports. That works well. Thank you as it is a much cleaner solution.0 -
In the upper right corner of the Lens Correction there is a menu marked "...". In here you will find a menu-option called "Disable Default lens correction"
This will do what you want.0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
In the upper right corner of the Lens Correction there is a menu marked "...". In here you will find a menu-option called "Disable Default lens correction"
This will do what you want.
Yes, and that is what I have done. But the video linked to by SizzlingBadger shows the ability to set defaults by camera and I was commending that this allowed me only to turn it on or off for all imports, not by camera.0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
In the upper right corner of the Lens Correction there is a menu marked "...". In here you will find a menu-option called "Disable Default lens correction"
This will do what you want.
Well, as it turns out, not really.
I tried this and it worked. I was pleased enough to post and comment that it worked but, this morning, I loaded some new photos and C1 applied the Lens Correction again. I then turned it off, set the default again and this time I created a template. When I created a new catalog and specified the template C1 again applied the lens distortion.
I then tried creating a new catalog without specifying the template and, again, C1 applied the lens correction. There seems to be something wrong with the Disable Default lens correction setting or I am doing something wrong.0 -
I have the same problem using a Leica X-Vario. Nothing you described is working for me. The some of the fotos seems to be cut randomly. I'm be able to enlarge them only in a single approach foto per foto which is a mass of work. I guess the smaller display of a picture is not only related to lens corrections. because when importing the same file from the camera to Lightroom everything is fine. 0 -
[quote="MikeFromMesa" wrote:
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
In the upper right corner of the Lens Correction there is a menu marked "...". In here you will find a menu-option called "Disable Default lens correction"
This will do what you want.
Well, as it turns out, not really.
I tried this and it worked. I was pleased enough to post and comment that it worked but, this morning, I loaded some new photos and C1 applied the Lens Correction again. I then turned it off, set the default again and this time I created a template. When I created a new catalog and specified the template C1 again applied the lens distortion.
I then tried creating a new catalog without specifying the template and, again, C1 applied the lens correction. There seems to be something wrong with the Disable Default lens correction setting or I am doing something wrong.
By template, what do you mean, just to be sure?0 -
[quote="KWo" wrote:
I have the same problem using a Leica X-Vario. Nothing you described is working for me. The some of the fotos seems to be cut randomly. I'm be able to enlarge them only in a single approach foto per foto which is a mass of work. I guess the smaller display of a picture is not only related to lens corrections. because when importing the same file from the camera to Lightroom everything is fine.
Please try the disabling I mentioned above.
There's no random applying of the lens distortion. If the lens distort over a certain percentage, CO will, per default, apply lens correction. With zoom-lenses, the amount of distortion differs through its range.0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
By template, what do you mean, just to be sure?
In trying to find out why I was unable to prevent C1 from making lens distortion corrections I tried many different paths.
1) I first tried clicking on the ... icon and selecting Disable Default Lens Correction. When I first did this and created a new catalog C1 imported the images without lens correction begin applied. When I tried again today it resumed applying lens correction in spite of this setting. I then reset the Disable function, exited, restarted C1 and created a new catalog and again it applied the lens correction.
2) The next thing I tried was to open C1, import some images, set the Disable functionality and, assuming that if I created a new Template for use when I created the next catalog (File -> Save As Template) it would use the current settings. I then exited, restarted C1, imported some files using the just created template and checked. The lens distortion had still been applied.
The only way I could find to create a new catalog and import raw images being assured that the lens distortion corrections would not be applied was to create a style with the lens correction turned off and then specify that during the creation of a new catalog and the importation of images.
Does this answer your question?0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
Please try the disabling I mentioned above.
What I have been trying to tell you is that I did try what you mentioned and it did not work. Oh, it worked for the first new catalog, but none after that.0 -
It's beyond me why Phase One thinks it's a good idea to apply lens distortion correction to images by default. When I imported my photos for the first time, I was wondering why so many of my compositions were sloppy. Until I realized C1 was automatically cutting of objects near the edges of the frame in many photos.
Lens distortion is a natural thing. If you want to correct it that's fine, but lots of photographers compose tight compositions in camera with the intention of the photo appearing as it did through the viewfinder.
Having to apply preset to make sure the images aren't missing their edges seems backwards...0 -
[quote="Christian Gruner" wrote:
[quote="KWo" wrote:
I have the same problem using a Leica X-Vario. Nothing you described is working for me. The some of the fotos seems to be cut randomly. I'm be able to enlarge them only in a single approach foto per foto which is a mass of work. I guess the smaller display of a picture is not only related to lens corrections. because when importing the same file from the camera to Lightroom everything is fine.
Please try the disabling I mentioned above.
There's no random applying of the lens distortion. If the lens distort over a certain percentage, CO will, per default, apply lens correction. With zoom-lenses, the amount of distortion differs through its range.
I already did this and tried also the other suggestion I could read here. Unfortunately as I mentioned before nothing give the full picture size. Only handmade by enlarging with the cut tool was sufficient, but it has to be done in a single step foto per foto.0 -
[quote="Aaron Morris" wrote:
Having to apply preset to make sure the images aren't missing their edges seems backwards...
I quite agree.
However the good thing about it is that once you have checked the preset checkbox on the import dialog box it remains checked and you don't have to worry about forgetting for future catalogs. I have just done that and now my images are no longer corrected for lens distortion unless I want them corrected.0 -
[quote="MikeFromMesa" wrote:
[quote="Aaron Morris" wrote:
Having to apply preset to make sure the images aren't missing their edges seems backwards...
I quite agree.
However the good thing about it is that once you have checked the preset checkbox on the import dialog box it remains checked and you don't have to worry about forgetting for future catalogs. I have just done that and now my images are no longer corrected for lens distortion unless I want them corrected.
It probably seems that way for some systems but of course the whole point about the rush to lens correction is that many modern lenses, especially for the "compact" and "mirrorless" markets, rely on lens correction to give half decent results and if shooting jpg you don't have the option to disable it at all. The manufacturers will take out the pixels from an image that they feel they need to take out because the image will otherwise be of reduced quality, distorted or simply not the specified aspect ratio.
Capture One does the same with the added complication that it may well be working with some unusual aspect ratio (crop tool) defined by the user.
The chances of satisfying all of the requirements of different users all of the time is small. So one has to allow user defined inclusion or exclusion. So one might add a table with a list of all cameras and lenses and ask people so set there own parameters for each combination ..... that would probably go down well, right?
Or use an existing feature - like a Preset. Maybe it would be better accepted if the functionality was just copied and renamed to a new feature? Use the same functionality but provide a discrete UI function to apply it?
Grant0 -
[quote="SFA" wrote:
It probably seems that way for some systems but of course the whole point about the rush to lens correction is that many modern lenses, especially for the "compact" and "mirrorless" markets, rely on lens correction to give half decent results and if shooting jpg you don't have the option to disable it at all. The manufacturers will take out the pixels from an image that they feel they need to take out because the image will otherwise be of reduced quality, distorted or simply not the specified aspect ratio.
Capture One does the same with the added complication that it may well be working with some unusual aspect ratio (crop tool) defined by the user.
The chances of satisfying all of the requirements of different users all of the time is small. So one has to allow user defined inclusion or exclusion. So one might add a table with a list of all cameras and lenses and ask people so set there own parameters for each combination ..... that would probably go down well, right?
Or use an existing feature - like a Preset. Maybe it would be better accepted if the functionality was just copied and renamed to a new feature? Use the same functionality but provide a discrete UI function to apply it?
I understand. For example my camera (a Canon 5D3) is advertised as having an image size of 5760 x 3840. However the camera actually takes images that are 5796 x 3870 with the understanding that the extra pixels may give a distorted image and that they can be removed and the remaining image would then be correct and complete. Hence the idea that editors can (or should) remove them to render the proper image. Some of my editors do so, some do not. However that is not what I am referring to.
C1 removes those pixels but also then applies a distortion correction which further removes some of the pixels and that is what I would prefer it did not do. I understand that the edges of the image contain distortions caused by the compromises made by the manufacturer in trying to create the lens, but I would prefer to make those decisions myself rather than have C1 make them for me. C1 says it gives me the choice by offering me the chance to disable the lens correction, but that functionality apparently does not work. Setting the Disable function does not disable the lens distortion functionality all the time. Some times it has worked for me, some times not.
Given my choice I would prefer to be able to see a set of cameras and set or unset the application of lens distortion based on that but short of that I would like the existing functionality to work as specified. Short of that I am satisfied with the ability to specify a preset when importing and that is what I am currently doing. It is not that I am unhappy with the existing C1 functionality. I use it rather than the alternatives (Lightroom and Dxo Optics Pro) because I am pleased with how it works and the functionality that it offers, but I would prefer that the defined lens distortion functionality on/off switch that I am told to use actually work.0 -
I had not heard about the ability to force lens distortion correct off.
But I was told that CO decides on whether to apply it by default based on the camera/lens combination. Above a certain threshold of expected distortion, it get turned on "automaticallY" and below it's turned off.
Do you see the application based on the lens you're shooting with? For example, maybe the kit lens has it on by default and an L prime off?0 -
[quote="BobRockefeller" wrote:
I had not heard about the ability to force lens distortion correct off.
But I was told that CO decides on whether to apply it by default based on the camera/lens combination. Above a certain threshold of expected distortion, it get turned on "automaticallY" and below it's turned off.
Do you see the application based on the lens you're shooting with? For example, maybe the kit lens has it on by default and an L prime off?
Interesting idea - turning distortion correction on or off based on the camera/lens combination.
In this case I am shooting with a Canon 5D3, which is a Canon FF camera, and using the Canon 24-105 lens. This is not a "kit" lens but it is the lens most usually purchased with the 5D3 and which most venders offer as a combination and at a discount. It is a relatively expensive lens and it carries a red band which specifies it as being an upper category lens. However it has considerable distortion when used at its widest.
This is my most commonly used lens and if the lens is used at 24mm and in a relatively close and enclosed area there is considerable distortion but if it is used as a landscape lens the images are OK as is. What I need to do is to take a variety of photos including both those where distortion is a problem and where it is not, turn off the distortion correction and then look to see what C1 does when the images are imported.
Thanks for the idea.0 -
Mike,
I have a 24-105 but most often use it with a 1D3 - so not FF but APS-H.
I imagine I miss the more evident likely distortion that you see on FF at the frame edges - APS-H will have cut that out already.
The correction is certainly applied selectively based, inter alia, on zoom where a zoom is involved.
This was most easily seen on my S90 compact - not officially supported but the S100 values are close enough. I can easily compare how C1 treats the RAW files with how the camera deals with jogs.
Even for that mere pocket camera (though one that was remarkably competent in its day for that part of the market) the adjustment values vary significantly with focal length but only at the wide end for distortion as far as I have seen.
Now, given that there are differences between the S90 and S100/S110 there are some slight differences with the edges selected and cropped by C1 compared to the out of camera jpg. However my observation is that Canon are comfortable with allowing some slight distortion of the image at the edge whereas C1 tends to be more conservative and shaves it off.
I have yet to carry out a similar comparison with the 24-105 or any of my other lenses. When I have checked the corrections made on an image they have always been so small and inconsequential for the subject matter that I have not been concerned about them. My 70-200 seems to be the same but more so.
I do appreciate that different bodies and different subjects may not be so forgiving. Also that at the other extreme full-on pixel pushing in PS (et al) probably means that the lens corrected starting point is really rather pointless!
That said I do take your point about expecting a setting applicable at one location to be applied at another although I'm sure if it was someone would come along with an alternative need. Maybe the option to apply or not apply should be added at time of import.
That would then only leave the session option to open files in a folder without "importing" as a source of uncontrolled files reliant upon the C1 camera specific default or user preset approach for intervention in the even of lens correction requirements.
I sometimes think that things become far more complicated than needed by any single individual as time passes.
Grant0 -
[quote="SFA" wrote:
Maybe the option to apply or not apply should be added at time of import.
Grant,
That option, of course, does exist if the user just creates a "no distortion correction" preset and sets or unsets it upon import. That is what I am presently doing with the intention of doing no distortion correction for most of my 24-105 images taken out doors and with distortion correction for those taken inside buildings where the distortion is not only more noticeable but actually annoying. The 24-105 is a very nice lens and I like it a lot, but it does have its drawbacks.
One of my "problems" is that most of my lenses do not have any C1 distortion correction modules at all. I mostly use 4 lenses - the Canon 24-105, a Canon 70-300 DO (which I really like), a Tamron 150-600 for birding and a Sigma 12-24, obviously an UWA. None of the last 3 have C1 distortion correction which just makes it easier for me to justify not applying the correction in any case.
As far as the "long" lenses, I would not want it, but the UWA sometimes desperately needs correction as I use it inside churches to get as much of the image as possible, and then I need to do some serious perspective correction.[quote="SFA" wrote:
I sometimes think that things become far more complicated than needed by any single individual as time passes.
Oh, yes. I certainly agree with that! On the other hand I don't think I would like to go back to my old Kodak Instamatic. 😄0 -
Hi Mike,
I'm with you on UWA which is exactly where one would expect challenges to appear.
That said I have a Samyang 14mm which, apparently, displays extreme "moustache" distortion. And it does but on APS-H and even more so an APS-C bodies you have to be shooting something with a lot of straight geometric lines to make it look unacceptable. Meanwhile the sharpness, given good manual focus technique was successfully deployed on the day, is a delight. It's totally manual so auto-correction would be a convoluted process anyway - thus probably not very interesting.
Once one goes very wide the question of correction can be something of a debate.
If one really, truly attempts to correct the image as shot to make it look "normal" one is into acceptance of significant compromise for correcting optical physics. 50Mb starter files may make the infill and binning acceptable I suppose.
On the other hand making an ultra wide image look "normal" seems to me to be a strange option in the digital age. The possible distortion of a UWA adds to the effect (used in moderation). To grab the scene for a "normal" mode output it might be simpler (and more flexible) to take several shots at a "standard" lens length and stitch them together, picking the preferred crop of the combined set for the final image.
Or maybe I am missing something in the concept.
Grant0
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