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Colors change as viewing scale is changed (And exported!)

PhilR59
Morning,

I encounter the following problems :

- Color is changing when scale from scaled to 100% (light blue become a white)
- This color change does not occur on all the photo of the series
- Exporting images were the color are changing while modifying the scale put the change too (again light blue disappear and I have white instead)

Complements :
- Win 7 SP1 full
- C1Pro 8.3.2 (build 8.3.2.12)
- D4S Nikon
- Proof profile : sRGB CEI (as in View / proof view)
- Export recipe : JPEG / profil = sRGB CEI / Sample down from native to 900x600 (change nothing as I tried with .TIFF full format the same effect appears)

Screen capture scaled :
http://imageshack.com/a/img909/5746/YNYaYu.jpg

Screen capture 50%:
http://imageshack.com/a/img911/7246/MehPXk.jpg

BTW : Nothing of this occurs with ViewNX / CNX2 / PS CS6
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  • PhilR59
    Good evening,

    I answer to myself, even answer is not the correct word.

    In fact the phenomena also occurs when I do export the same image into a JPEG or Tiff file (RAW format as original), and here is start to be just annoying, it starts to be considered as a real bug here. And it is really hard to understand as other images from the same camera with the same lens same exposition setting (I shoot in manual, ISO is set as speed and diaphragm) do not present the same problem. Within the full series I detect some with this strange behavior while others are juts fine.

    Any idea here ?
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  • PhilR59
    Good evening,

    It seems that inspiration is not coming for the readers who did pass by. Maybe an entry to the support will help then ...
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  • dreckly
    I am having difficulty understanding your question (language issue):~/

    Is your question about the lines of windows appearing as a blue colour but, at a
    different level of zoom view, the lines of windows appear more as a white colour?

    The 100% view is more important to show properly.

    Try using the LOUPE tool over those blue coloured windows.
    Does the perception (colour value/KELVIN) change in real time?
    Perhaps the KELVIN (cool/warm) temperature changes with zoom?
    If so maybe this is more to do with your screen driver (video driver)
    and you could try toggling the setting for your preferences (openCL).
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  • PhilR59
    Hi Robert,

    Thank you for having passing by and giving an advice.

    To summarize :
    - Images are correct when viewed at "scaled" position of the zoom, since you use 50% ratio or above (67% / 100%) the behavior is the same, the blue tone just disappear from the image, not only the lines.
    - This behavior is the same when you do export the image, any format any size (I tried .JPG, .TIFF, and different sizes)

    The most intriguing here is that I have made like 200 photos of the same subject using same ISO, same aperture, same speed, and some of the images behave this strange way, and some are just fine, this make me thing there is something wrong somewhere, but what ?

    Philippe.
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  • dreckly
    [quote="PhilR59" wrote:

    Edit > Preferences > General > Hardware Acceleration >...
    Whatever you have then try the 'other' settings and maybe even reboot after each change. For something to only hit one programme (C1), for some pictures and not others it ?has? to be the video drivers. (DOES hold true at % viewing in C1)

    If you have different images shot on different occasions perhaps you caught the fluorescent strip lighting on a different part of the electrical phase... wacky. (doesn't hold true at % viewing in C1)

    Even wackier perhaps those floors are using those new multi-LED lamps where you can dial or otherwise select your level and hue of lighting. (doesn't hold true at % viewing in C1)

    Wackiest... Smurf pixies are having a rave up party and turning on their blue lights over various floors? 😁 (doesn't hold true at % viewing in C1)
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  • PhilR59
    Hi Drecky,

    Thank you for having passing by, and apologize for late answer I was quite busy and mostly out of internet connection.

    I did not try yet your recipe, the video driver can be a way to explore, what does intriguing me the most it is the fact some pictures works and some do not even when taken within the same second.

    I got the point for the variation of light but still, why C1 only does interpret wrongly ? PS (CS6) and ViewNX /CNX2 does it correctly.
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  • ChrisM
    Hello Phil,

    There is quite a bit unclear with the CO1 export/review function to jpeg and tiff images.
    I have opened a support case on this subject, but have so far not succeeded to make the issues clear to phase one support.
    To summarize:
    -CO1 raw images are shown in the full monitor gamut (of course limited by/depending on the chosen proof profile).
    -ALL tiff and jpeg images, regardless of their embedded export profile, are shown in the srgb color space, regardless of your monitor color space.

    This leads to a possible clipping and shifting of colors when:
    -You have a monitor with a larger color gamut than srgb, e.g. (but not only) a wide gamut display, and:
    -That monitor is not calibrated to the srgb color space but to its native (larger) color space.

    I have an Eizo coloredge monitor calibrated to its native color space, which is approximately (but not equal to) adobe rgb.
    Quite simply: when I export images with colors outside of the srgb color gamut, I see a loss of color vividness, and/or a hue shift.

    This issue is due to the fact that CO1 respects the embedded color profile with jpeg and tiff images, but does not fully color manage these images to the viewing on your monitor. If someone can add to my limited knowledge, perhaps he can clear up what exactly is happening, but all image viewing in CO1 of jpeg and tiff images is constricted to the srgb color space.

    Only way to get past the color clipping and hue shifting between the raw image and the viewed export, is to either set/calibrate your monitor to the srgb color space (which makes absolutely no sense if you have a wide gamut display), or to set the output and viewing profile to srgb.

    Now, I'm trying hard to find ways to communicate this issue to phase one support, but I am asked for screendumps to show the issue, when screendumps are by default assigned the srgb color profile, aso they will not show the difference between the color vividness of raw images on a wide gamut display, and the srgb clipped export images. Neither will a screen dump show the hue shifts.
    Sending them raw files and jpeg's may be a way, but when I asked phase one support if their technical staff uses wide gamut displays calibrated to their native color space, I got no reaction.
    It's one of these issues, where you really have to go to their headquarters, take your monitor and images, and show it to them I guess...

    Bt.w.: even on "standard" displays, you can get color clipping and hue shifts, when the display is calibrated to its native color space. My 2011 macbook pro has a high resolution display that is supposed to approximate srgb, but when properly calibrated with an x-rite i1 display pro, the screen can show yello colors that are far outside of srgb.
    So depending on your screen type, and its calibration, you can have particular colors that clip os have a hue shift.

    only real solution to get the export colors in line with the raw viewing colors, is for phase one to finish and complete their color management chain, and to properly manage the viewing of jpeg and tiff images.
    But how to get them to understand the issue?.....

    regards
    Chris
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  • Permanently deleted user
    I've found in previous versions that CO does not always regenerate the image and/or thumbnail preview when changes are made to image unless I zoom in to 1:1 or if that didn't force a re-gen by chaining another parameter. This lead to different color balance at different magnification level. I also sometimes used the 'regenerate preview' menu function. I haven't seen this behavior lately though.
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  • PhilR59
    Hi,

    Thanks Chris and Alex for passing by. I understand there is something wrong somewhere but not easy to demonstrate to Phase One team at one point.

    Therefore I will push the point to the support with all the needed data.

    I have investigate a little bit more and I can say it is not only the blue lights which are affected but the entire blue channel which is impacted ad it is easy to see that with the color picker (the one you use with the color balance function), at "adapted" ratio view, if you put this cursor on the blue lines you see something like Red :16 Blue :36 green :14, when changing for another ratio, with the same tool you get Red :16 Blue :19 green :14 , so where is my blue ?
    Furthermore you may do the same in another place of the image, like the first building, mainly white/yellow cast, the same does occur when changing ratio the Blue channel is affected and the original value is divided by 2 or so.
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  • Marcin Pazio
    I have the same problem, but so far I've noticed that it can be noticed only with very noisy images (Nikon V2 @ 3200ISO, artificial light from compact fl and LEDs). It may have something to do with NR/WB and image scale interpolation.
    I'm too busy to make any further research on this issue at the moment.
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