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Healing Mask to Operate Similarly to Magic Brush

Comments

16 comments

  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    FYI, you can use a mask (created with the magic brush) to limit the area that a healing brush modifies. 

    When I was trying to remove a rope fence behind a subject, I used the healing brush to remove it, but where the rope intersected the clothing of the subject, the healing brush didn't do quite the right thing.  So, I just used a mask to mask out the clothing so the healing brush effect didn't bleed into the clothing and only applied to the background.

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  • David Michael Jacobs

    Thank you John Friend. I'll give it a try.

    Tried it! I'm not getting it to work for a full body partially hidden by a tree with leaves between me and the subject. As soon a I activate the healing brush, the magic mask disappears and places me in healing mode.It would be so much simpler if the healing mask worked in the same way that the magic mask does or there can be an option to allow it to work the same way when necessary. 

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  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    It's not clear what you're trying.  I was suggesting that you create a mask first in a completely separate operation.  That then allows you to control what pixels are affected by the healing brush and which are not.  There is no way that I know of to combine magic brush and healing into the same operation.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    I don't understand either, John.

    mask first in a completely separate operation

    So you create an adjustment layer having a mask.

    That then allows you to control what pixels are affected by the healing brush and which are not

    Using a healing brush will create another layer of the healing type.

    But these layers are not connected in any way, the adjustment layer mask will not influence what the healing layer heals.

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  • Ian Wilson
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    John Friend - it reads to me as if you are suggesting a technique that might work if you were removing something (the rope fence in your example) using a pixel editor app like Photoshop or Affinity Photo. But Capture One isn't one of those.

    Ian

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  • David Michael Jacobs

    Why not design the healing brush so that it could work in a similar fashion as the magic brush? It could be incorporated as an option.

    I tried using magic brush to create a mask as 1 adjustment layer. Then, I used the healing brush and Capture One created a 2nd layer. The mask created by magic brush didn't aid me in anyway once Capture One created the 2nd layer, aka the healing layer.

    I submitted my post as a request to add a new option to the healing brush to make it easy to remove obscured objects without producing multiple corrections in a small area, effectively creating a mottling effect.

    There have been many changes to Capture One since its inception. With each change or addition, Capture One has become the excellent tool that is today. Why stop there? Why not add more functionality to make it even better?

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    Why not design the healing brush so that it could work in a similar fashion as the magic brush? It could be incorporated as an option.

    Absolutely.

    Other users are often trying to help with explaining workarounds, nothing wrong with that imo. There is no workaround in this case though.

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  • David Michael Jacobs

    If one has to attempt a workaround, then the application is lacking in that area. Capture One has a major competitor, Adobe. If Capture One is lacking and Adobe ups its game, Capture One could lose subscribers to its competitor. For that reason, it's in Capture One's best interest to, routinely, add new features.

    The moderator, Ian Wilson, mentioned Capture One doesn't perform pixel editing, with reference to John Friend's post. The healing mask attempts pixel editing, in my opinion, when part of an image is removed and the application attempts to cure this missing data by replacing it with a copy of something near the correction site. Isn't noise reduction pixel editing? 

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  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    Ian Wilson

    It reads to me as if you are suggesting a technique that might work if you were removing something (the rope fence in your example) using a pixel editor app like Photoshop or Affinity Photo. But Capture One isn't one of those.

    Well, it worked for me in Capture one just a few days ago.  I used a healing brush layer to remove a rope fence in the scene and where the rope intersected with the people, the healing brush didn't work quite right as it healed into the clothing of the people.  So, I just went into the mask for that healing brush layer and masked out the clothing (using the mask eraser to erase where the healing brush was touching the clothing) so the healing brush effect did not extend into the clothing and I ended up with the rope gone and a nice clean edge to the clothing (which the healing brush did not do on its own).  I did all this in Capture One 22, no pixel editor used.

    Note, I'm not arguing against the feature request.  Masking and healing (particularly subject removal) needs to get a lot smarter in Capture One as it's falling way, way behind Lightroom.  I was suggesting a temporary work-around for some situations that has worked for me.

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  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    BeO

    But these layers are not connected in any way, the adjustment layer mask will not influence what the healing layer heals.

    My first explanation was not quite correct.  I did healing on a healing layer.  Then, where the healing spilled into another subject that created a problem, I used a mask on that same layer to mask out the part of the healing I didn't want (technically, I used the mask eraser to fine tune exactly what the healing brush was targeting). 

    In my case, I was healing out a rope fence that went behind a couple people. Where the rope intersected the people's clothing, the healing brush did not do things correctly.  So, I masked out the healing effect (on the same healing layer) and kept it from affecting the clothing.  The end result was that the rope was cleanly healed out and the clothing retained it's nice clean edge.  I couldn't find a way to get the healing to do that on its own - I had to use a mask with it to achieve the desired result.

    I should say that none of this is an argument against the feature request.  Masking and healing need to get a lot smarter in C1 as they are really getting left behind Lightroom and us customers are noticing.   

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    David,

    If one has to attempt a workaround, then the application is lacking in that area. Capture One has a major competitor, Adobe. If Capture One is lacking and Adobe ups its game, Capture One could lose subscribers to its competitor.

    Generalizations are seldom true. And probably don't help much in supporting your request.

    People discuss here and/or give hints which can be helpful (or not) for the person who was requesting a feature.

    The discussions can (or not) also be helpful for the product team to either better understand the request and/or to give the 'right' priority (in their books). 

    The assessment of workarounds (provided by the requester but also from others) not only helps to understand the effort for the user (which can influence the priority) but also can help to actually understand the request in the first place. There is even a special section in the request form for this.

    We are all users here in this thread, this is mostly the case, even moderators (at least) Ian might not be related to the Capture One company, and there is a big chance that even staff eventually replying here have ususally no say for this feature request, so there will not be a discussion with real deciders here, most of the time.

    So, no worries, enjoy the discussion around your request (which also helps to keep it high in the forum order, so more people may up- (or down-) vote your request, and maybe other opinions and descriptions of workarounds can help you to work better until the feature is (maybe) being implemented. 

    And the classification of software as "pixel editors" is probably nothing worth discussing. Ian was just mentioning that the technique described by John is not working in C1 but maybe in a typical "pixel editor" like Photoshop, he was not objecting that your feature request would eventually be implemented in C1, despite not having its roots in pixel editing.

    Cheers, 
    BeO

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    John, 

    When you say you used a mask on the healing layer to correct the unwanted healing do you mean you used the eraser brush to fine-tune the healing mask?

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  • Ian Wilson
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    John Friend - now I understand what you say you did, and yes I frequently do that too. I thought you were referring to the technique you can use in Photoshop or Affinity Photo where you make a selection before using the healing or cloning tool, so that it can only work on the selected area.

    Ian

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  • John Friend
    Top Commenter

    BeO - Yes, used the eraser brush on the healing area.  I've clarified my previous post.  My memory about how I did it was wrong so I just went back to the image to see for sure.

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  • David Michael Jacobs

    Thank you Ian and BeO for your response. I stand corrected and myself reprove. Ian, I didn't think you were arguing against my request. I knew you were only replying to John Friend's writing. Yes, BeO, my generalization is unnecessary and it takes away from the useful techniques that John, Ian, you and other users bring forth to this forum. Yes, I'll do as you suggest, sit back and enjoy the ride.

     

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    :-)

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