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Capture One vs. Lightroom, C1 is less saturated??

NNN635766355050029102
Hi all,

I've been considering switching from Lightroom to Capture One after reading many rave reviews on C1's superior color management out of the box. I saw some pretty impressive side-by-sides: compared to LR, C1's unprocessed color corrects were richer, typically more saturated, had more pop. C1 also seemed to emphasize the reds a bit.

So I downloaded a trail of C1, ran a quick test, and saw the exact opposite (pardon the messy looking sandwiches):

This is the untouched LR import (from tethered capture):
http://1.static.img-dpreview.com/files/p/TS560x560~forums/56393726/50a275a635194dd9bc31677d41b5bc26

And this is the untouched C1 import (from card):
http://3.static.img-dpreview.com/files/p/TS560x560~forums/56393726/b96f169438004040a019024171479c5f

I double checked and as far as I can tell C1 is using the correct camera profile.

For those of you that have used both -- do these results make sense? Could I be doing something wrong? I understand that I can adjust everything to my hearts content from here, but it doesn't seem worth switching over to C1 if LR looks better out of the box...

Thanks in advance for your help/advice!
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Comments

9 comments

Date Votes
  • Paul Steunebrink
    You sure wetting my appetite, not only because of the sandwiches! 😉

    Forget what you have read elsewhere. Colors, saturation, it all very much depend on so many factors, like which camera is used or what lighting.

    What is really wetting my appetite though is that the CO8 image differentiates color tones in such a rich and subtle way, that I not only see the sandwiches but nearly taste them. I see real sandwiches (it makes me forget it is actually an image). The Lr image show me an image of sandwiches. Not making me hungry.

    You select what you prefer. It's your taste so to speak!
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  • Doug Peterson
    There is no right or wrong in color, unless you are doing art reproduction or scientific studies.

    Find settings that suit your aesthetics and the needs of your clients, then use the [...] in the top right of any given tool and select to save those as defaults. You'll never have to touch those controls again when importing or shooting tethered, unless you want to make further changes. They will become the new "default" used any time a raw is seen for the first time.

    The improvement in quality going from LR to C1 is in things like color discrimination (showing two slightly different colors as being different), color linearity (showing the same hue in a contrasty-light subject from shadow to highlight), detail extraction (pixel quality of detail, regardless of sharpening especially when using a good camera like a Phase One or Leaf back where there is more detail that can be extracted) etc. Whether the universal-default-as-installed numbers suit you is more or less a crap shoot. It's like buying a set of really nice speakers and complaining that they don't boost the treble and bass as much out-of-the-box compared to a low-end set of speakers... just turn the dials once and forget about it.

    Once you get used to the basics consider a training class where you'll learn more advanced workflows like having multiple "defaults" which you can rapidly change between by keyboard shortcut depending on the subject matter (e.g. a still life default, a food default, a portrait default): http://www.digitaltransitions.com/event ... 10-07-2015
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  • ---
    [quote="NNN635766355050029102" wrote:
    ect camera profile.
    For those of you that have used both -- do these results make sense? Could I be doing something wrong? I understand that I can adjust everything to my hearts content from here, but it doesn't seem worth switching over to C1 if LR looks better out of the box...


    hi, i use both but like c1 more but i don't belief and can´t verify what those expert here are able to see. you can get great results with both applications. but the most obvious difference i see in your sample images is that white - balance does not match. if you don't use a colorchecker to set WB for each application separate WB is interpreted different.
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  • TC
    I have recently started to use Capture One and had little experience with LR. I shoot a colorcard, make adjustments to fine tune the image and copy to next image. Shooting a color or gray card is an essential step in ones workflow.
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  • NNN635766355050029102
    Thanks everyone for the input!

    Can anyone point me to an article that discusses, in depth, how and why Capture One’s raw interpretation is better? Is it performing “intelligent†localized tweaks (like structure, clarity, etc.) as part of the interpretation or is it just somehow globally reading overall increased fidelity/latitude?

    Thanks!
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  • ---
    hi, i don't think c1 is superior to other converter it is different. for me it is the best solution for low iso images. what makes it my favorite is not only color rendering or detail it is the speed i can get the desired results. the best advice i can give is learn it, use it and trust your eyes ! all those articles and reviews i have seen over the years are more or less biased or use default settings which is nonsense anyway.
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  • Francis Hemming
    [quote="Horseoncowboy " wrote:
    ... but the most obvious difference i see in your sample images is that white - balance does not match. if you don't use a colorchecker to set WB for each application separate WB is interpreted different.

    I agree with this. The Capture One image in this case looks a lot better mainly because the white balance appears more correct, the entire LR image appears warmed not more saturation. Other aspects of the image look better as well, but that might be because of the downsizing for web differences, and may not appear at actual size.

    A little tweak to the controls (or set a new default if that is what you wish), and it would be more punchy without getting warmed up so it looks all dull and the bread looking old.
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  • Christian Gruner
    [quote="NNN635766355050029102" wrote:
    Hi all,

    I've been considering switching from Lightroom to Capture One after reading many rave reviews on C1's superior color management out of the box. I saw some pretty impressive side-by-sides: compared to LR, C1's unprocessed color corrects were richer, typically more saturated, had more pop. C1 also seemed to emphasize the reds a bit.

    So I downloaded a trail of C1, ran a quick test, and saw the exact opposite (pardon the messy looking sandwiches):

    This is the untouched LR import (from tethered capture):
    http://1.static.img-dpreview.com/files/p/TS560x560~forums/56393726/50a275a635194dd9bc31677d41b5bc26

    And this is the untouched C1 import (from card):
    http://3.static.img-dpreview.com/files/p/TS560x560~forums/56393726/b96f169438004040a019024171479c5f

    I double checked and as far as I can tell C1 is using the correct camera profile.

    For those of you that have used both -- do these results make sense? Could I be doing something wrong? I understand that I can adjust everything to my hearts content from here, but it doesn't seem worth switching over to C1 if LR looks better out of the box...

    Thanks in advance for your help/advice!


    Have you picked the Whitebalance from the same point on the 2 images? If not, you cannot compare them directly, other than concluding that LR and CO take different approaches to their respective defaults.
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  • Mark Moore
    [quote="NNN635766355050029102" wrote:

    I've been considering switching from Lightroom to Capture One after reading many rave reviews on C1's superior color management out of the box. I saw some pretty impressive side-by-sides: compared to LR, C1's unprocessed color corrects were richer, typically more saturated, had more pop. C1 also seemed to emphasize the reds a bit.


    I have just switched to C1P from LR6, and wrote a long-ish review of the pros and cons (here).

    The differences are often camera specific, but I found that Lightroom tends to over-saturate its reds compared to C1. Here is an example of processing an E-M5 high-ISO file in C1 and LR, where LR completely blows out the red channels due to the default saturation and Adobe Standard colour profile pushing the red tones far outside of the output sRGB space.

    After processing a ton of examples like this from several different cameras, I think that I like C1's colour and UI better, while preferring LRs key-wording and indexing.

    C1 has quite a lot of quirks (mostly due to terminology) and bugs (for me, the inability to open 16 bit grayscale TIFF film scans...). But the Phase One support folk are on the ball and over the last year or so it is clear that engineering are working hard on improving the software.
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