3.7 SE to PRO ugrade

Comments

27 comments

  • NN88997121
    Yeah, the whole thing is nutty if you as me. For example... I have SE and am told that I will be upgraded to Pro when the new release is out. So it seems to me we should be allow now to up load the Pro version since we are going to be classified as a Pro user and have to pay more in the future for upgrades. It's totally insane if you ask me.
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  • NN160077UL11
    I beleive I need to be more specific about this.
    This has been P1's SE->Pro upgrade policy:
    \"If you are currently using C1 SE you can update to the V3.6 (when released) and any V3.6.x updates at no charge, the same as C1 LE and C1 PRO users. All V3.6.x service/maintenance releases will be available for C1 SE users at no charge. If you are a C1 SE owner (with no 5 pack update), you are entitled to 1 free major upgrade which would be the Spring release. Since there will not be a C1 SE Spring version, you will be able to activate the C1 PRO Spring release based on a C1 SE -> C1 Pro conversion which will replace the C1 SE Update that you were entitled to. The C1 PRO Fall Update will be a charged to you just as it would have been if C1 SE had continued to exist.

    If you are a C1 SE customer who has also purchased the \"5 pack update\", you will be upgraded to C1 PRO beginning with the Spring release. As with all C1 PRO upgrades this will include 2 additional free major updates, in this case, Fall 2005 and Spring 2006. \"

    3.7 is a 3.6 maintenance release, even if renumbered, and not a major upgrade. With the next major release being delayed to later this year the talk of spring and fall releases above is no longer valid.

    So even if SE users are converted to Pro with 3.7 I beleive that SE users with the 5 update pack are still entitled to the next major update + 2 additional major updates, ie three major updates in total.

    I therefore assume that \"INCL. 2 FREE FUTURE UPDATES\" in the latest upgrade policy is a mistake and that it should be 3 (three) future updates.
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  • Flashram_Peter_AUS
    I totally agree with Gnordstrom, this release 3.7 isn't a Major Release it is a update to the major 3.x.x release and if they are upgrading the SE peope to Pro then that is their decision. The Version 4 and 2 further major upgrades for those that purchased the 5 upgrade pack in good faith, should been given this as their upgrade parth.

    But will Capture One be around by then with the other converters comming out that appear to be starting to get close to Capture One.

    I think Phase One has lost the plot on this, they aren't sticking by what was initially discussed adnorsium about this.

    They should take on board what the users are saying, make this upgrade to pro for SE users not counted in the upgrade count as it shouldn't be and stick with the agreed arrangement.

    I can see a lot of disgruntled SE users with the 5 update pack, starting to maybe start looking at what their consumer rights are and discuss those with maybe some sort of group action to be looked at down the track.

    It is interesting for an official Phase One support forum to not get too many replies to postings from Users looking for answers.
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  • SteveC
    [quote="
    It is interesting for an official Phase One support forum to not get too many replies to postings from Users looking for answers.[/quote]

    The title of this forum has a different title from "official Phase One support".

    "Phase One Official User to User Forum"

    Perhaps this would explain the apparent lack of response from the Phase One people?
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  • Flashram_Peter_AUS
    SteveC,

    No company in their right minds and I use that term loosely with respect the PhaseOne, would put up a forum and leave it solely to the forum members just to interact with concerns and problems.

    If this is the type of respect we as customers get from PhaseOne then it is no wonder there are so many problems with the software. It just goes to show the implication of lack of internal respect that the programmers and management must have for each other.

    Thank God there is Rawworkflow.com for support on this buggy software, that is going from bad to worse as each new upgrade comes out.

    I don't think it will be all that long before someone starts up a Class Action against Phase One to get the software that we have paid for, and or get our money refunded for the Software that hasn't been supplied as of yet at all.
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  • NN88997121
    #Deleted by moderator due to not obaying forum rules#

    http://forum.phaseone.com/viewtopic.php?t=42
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  • Anonymous
    All the answers to these postings are readily available from the Phase One web site. There is sufficient information regarding the decisions and the handling of the discontinuation of version SE at this forum, and at the main page.
    Forum:
    At Announcements and FAQ’s – Sales related, there are topics of:
    • [i]Phase One Discontinues C1 SE[/i]
    • 5 Update packs for LE/SE
    In addition there is a Sticky link to direct any Sales Related Questions to Phase One.

    Located at www.phaseone.com under Software > Hot News > Discontinuation of SE has detailed information regarding this issue. http://www.phaseone.com/Content/Softwar ... -d-,7.aspx

    This location includes a hotlink email address directly to the Marketing department for any further questions or clarifications.

    The information is presented sufficiently. Options exist for choices of upgrade to Pro as well as a downgrade to LE of the Capture One software. It also provides a means to contact Sales and Marketing departments directly if you wish to discuss the topic further.

    Finally, the Public Guidelines and Rules that pertain to the use of the Forum are available for reviewing at the Announcement Read Before Posting on the first line of each Forum Topic
    http://forum.phaseone.com/viewtopic.php?t=42


    Sincerely,

    k c
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  • NN88997121
    Let me rephrase what I've said: I won't be a C1 user... I've found my answer to my batch processing with Photoshop CS2. 👿
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  • NN160077UL11
    [quote="Keith Carpenter" wrote:
    All the answers to these postings are readily available from the Phase One web site. There is sufficient information regarding the decisions and the handling of the discontinuation of version SE at this forum, and at the main page.


    With all due respect,
    this is not true. If you read my second post above you'll find what was originally said to be the Se->Pro upgrade policy. There's one major difference in regards to what the SE+5UP users now get with 3.7.


    This location includes a hotlink email address directly to the Marketing department for any further questions or clarifications.


    I did send an email and the answer I got was in short:
    I'm theoretically correct (earlier I've been told I'm technically correct) but,
    -It was decided in the last minute to make 3.7 available free of charge due to bugs in 3.6.
    -3.7 is not really a maintenance release as it has new features.
    -3.7 could have been a paid for release (repeated twice).
    -SE+5UP users will get 3.7 incl. two free major updates as said in the latest upgrade policy and not three upgrades as originally said.

    So what is it P1 is saying?
    The fact that I'm both theoretically and technically correct about P1 not honoring it's original promise is not reason enough for P1 to change the SE->Pro policy back to what was originally said?

    That because 3.7 could have been a paid for release justify that SE+5UP users in a sence pay for 3.7 by having the entitled three future upgrades reduced by one?

    And out of curiousity, did P1 never intend to release a 3.6 maintenance release with bug fixes?

    I guess I have to reluctantly accept what is P1's latest SE->Pro upgrade policy but I must emphasize that I'm not happy about it.
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  • Flashram_Peter_AUS
    I hope Photoshop CS 2 is capable of what it says regarding RAW conversion and am waiting for it to become freely available with it's impending release. If so, then I will be dropping Caputre One and using that instead, this upgrade policy they keep changing around for us, that have purchased the 5 upgrades in good faith, just sucks. We do the right thing, part with our money, wait, through buggy software to get what appears to be certainly more buggy software and they change their idea of fairness again.

    It is no wonder Micheal Tapes of RawWorkflow.com which had a much better support forum than this one does, has severed ties with Phase One.

    Even the new RawShooter software seems to be nearly at similar levels of output that PhaseOne and it is currently free as well.

    I just wish this company would stick by their one statement and do the correct thing by their customers.
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  • tvo
    Dear all,

    It is never fair to existing users when a product is discontinued. People will always feel mistreated and as a company you may risk losing customers. We aplogize for this inconvienience. It has not been an easy decision, but we truly believe that it was the best decision we could make to overcome some of the problems we had with Capture One.

    Due to technical problems especially on the Windows platform we were forced to make a decision on how to proceed with our product road map. We could spend the extra time in R&D on maintaining different versions of the software, or we could spend all our time and resources on moving forward and creating a strong, innovative and reliable LE and PRO products for our loyal users. We want our customers to have the best RAW converter in the world, because if they do not have the best and most professional tools then it is more difficult for them to run a profitable business. To focus on this we decided to discontinue a product i.e. SE.

    3.7 is not a paid release (even though both the LE version and the PRO version have been considerably improved over the last 12 months and now contain many new features (if you compare with the last paid release)). All SE users are entitle to a free SE update, which is why they all get one PRO update. The 5 pack customers get two updates (since they paid extra money). This solution is fair to SE users. Also, it is fair to existing PRO users, who paid more to get PRO and PRO to PRO updates than SE users did for their products. For those SE users who do not want PRO features or to pay for future PRO to PRO udates have the option of downgrading to LE for free.

    Phase One could prevent SE users from getting the extra PRO update by waiting on the next paid release before we upgraded them. However, this would not be beneficial for you as a user or for Capture One as a leading RAW workflow. Phase One believes that this policy is fair to everybody and that the decision to discontinue SE will benefit both PRO, SE and LE users in the future. Of course, we hope that all of you will agree once you get your upgrades/downgrades (depending on what you choose) and experience the future developments on Capture One.

    If you have questions, comments or concerns about updates and upgrade you are welcome to contact marketing@phaseone.dk.

    Thank you.

    Trine Voss
    VP Capture One marketing & sales
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  • NN160077UL11
    Trine,

    I beleive the reason behind P1's decision to discontinue SE is well known to most of us and I don't disagree with you on this (even though SE had about the right features for my needs).

    What I'm asking for is a simple answer to why P1 decided to change the SE->Pro policy. It's quite obvious by now that it's not a mistake as I first thought.

    One interpretation of your answer is that P1 all of a sudden thought the original policy to be too generous to the SE+5UP users and not fair to all other users, hence the decision to change the value of the 5 update pack from two to one free update.
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  • tvo
    Hi,

    You are right there is no mistake. The 5 pack upgrade to PRO is with 2 extra updates regardless of how many policies we publish (and we promise you we will not publish anymore 😉 ). We will not and cannot provide better conditions for SE users than for PRO users, who have paid more for PRO (even with the 5 pack update). We feel that by offering a PRO upgrade with two extra update is generous, and most importantly fair, regardless of what we offer other SE users. This upgrade offer corresponds to what you have paid for, which in our opinion is fair treatment of our customers.

    This upgrade should be about whether or not you as a customer is being treated fairly, and not about what everybody else gets. It is Phase One's job to figure out a way to satisfy each one of our customers. We sincerely hope you and all other SE users decide to update and that you will enjoy the new version you will receive.

    Best regards,

    Trine Voss
    VP Capture One sales & marketing
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  • Flashram_Peter_AUS
    Trine Voss,

    So if we are on SE and have the 5 pack, when the 3.7 is released it will be for us an upgrade to PRO and then we have 2 further major upgrades as well. Yes ???

    If so, that isn't what was originally discussed on the Phase One site and on Micheal Tapes site as well, when this was being discussed at length previously.

    Seems like you have gone back on 1 upgrade for for the faithfull SE 5 pack customers.
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  • NN160077UL11
    Sorry,
    Could not resist posting this 😄

    While searching for some other info I found this on P1's web site under Software/Discontinued Software:


    \"If you purchased the SE 5 update pack we will offer you an attractive Capture One PRO upgrade including 4 major PRO updates in 2005/2006.\"

    Anyways,
    I see no reason continuing this discussion so this will be my last post on this subject.
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  • Anonymous
    It is no wonder Micheal Tapes of RawWorkflow.com which had a much better support forum than this one does, has severed ties with Phase One.



    <<<< A Change for Michael T and Phase One >>>>

    Effective April 1, I have made the decision to not renew my contract with Phase One, as their Capture One Senior Design Consultant. Howerver, I will continue to be a Capture One Reseller, run this forum, and to support Capture One users.

    I will be adding new and exiciting products to the mix here at RawWorkflow.com, as well as more educational material, including a weekly article from yours truly (to begin in May).

    As this forum is no longer subsidized by P1, I ask you to please support the forum by purchasing from our fine array of growing products, including Capture One, Gretag Macbeth/Eye-One, Archive Creator, WhiBal, ETC Camera Profiles, and a few more to be annouced shortly.

    Thanks to all of the forum members who have been so loyal and helpful to the forum and its membership. I could not do this without you. My humble appreciation.

    Let's carry on.
    __________________
    Michael Tapes
    Owner RawWorkflow.com

    kc
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  • Flashram_Peter_AUS
    And Keith you point is what from posting that info from Michael Tapes. Atleast he had the balls to say he had severed ties with Phase One, and I think that is a disappointment considering the extent that he has supported the program in the past.

    I see you made no comment on the information regarding those that have SE and have purchased the 5 pack that we would be receiveing the PRO upgarde and 4 major releases after that as faithfull customers.
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  • Anonymous
    My point is a simple one. Don’t speak for someone else especially when that someone else has posted publicly exactly their situation. If anyone believes that Mr. Tapes has severed ties with Phase One, then re-read his post.

    Fact is RawWorkFlow has provided excellent support to Phase One customers and will continue to do so. The volume of support provided to customers by Phase One Tech Support is significantly higher. What is important is that Users have a variety of choices as to where they go for answers.

    My personal comment regarding the SE 5-update situation is to Deal With It. The tough decision was explained in detail by Phase One, and it's time to move on. If hanging onto 5 updates is what is important, take the Downgrade for Free, and keep the 5-updates.
    Life is too short to be spending time on a Forum designed to be constructive and helpful with complaining postings.

    Very Sincerely,

    K C
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  • NN88997121
    [quote="Keith Carpenter" wrote:
    My point is a simple one. Don’t speak for someone else especially when that someone else has posted publicly exactly their situation. If anyone believes that Mr. Tapes has severed ties with Phase One, then re-read his post.

    Fact is RawWorkFlow has provided excellent support to Phase One customers and will continue to do so. The volume of support provided to customers by Phase One Tech Support is significantly higher. What is important is that Users have a variety of choices as to where they go for answers.

    My personal comment regarding the SE 5-update situation is to Deal With It. The tough decision was explained in detail by Phase One, and it's time to move on. If hanging onto 5 updates is what is important, take the Downgrade for Free, and keep the 5-updates.
    Life is too short to be spending time on a Forum designed to be constructive and helpful with complaining postings.

    Very Sincerely,

    K C


    How can one be constructive about C1 when it doesn't work as one feels like it should. I'm dealing with it just fine with PSCS2 😜
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  • thomas1111
    After reading posts in this thread I got totaly confused. I upgraded from SE to PRO. Giving me 2 free upgrades. I also got 2 free PRO upgrades for my SE free upgrade package. At that time I thought this offer was ok and what I understand from PhaseOne it has not changed, or ?? So what should I complain for? Today there are other offers valid but for me that is quite a different story.
    Also I do not understand why Michael was involved into this thread about upgrades!

    The only thing I got a bit dissapointed about was of the rather limited extra features I got when upgrading to PRO.
    Otherwise I must say I am very happy with the program. I can not find that there are extremely many bugs in it and for me it works quite fine. If one wants to look for bugs I recommend to check ACDSee 7.0.
    Regards
    ThomasD
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  • JVasek
    I think I'm in a similar situation to ThomasD - I originally purchased LE this I upgraded to SE and then I added the 5 updatepack, finally in October went for the SE to Pro deal.

    LE > SE > SE+5 > PRO

    So I'm currently on Pro but I've no idea what I'm entitled to anymore at one time I thought I would be on Pro + 4 updates as a result of the chopping and changing of policies, I'm not so sure. Anyway I've written to Marketing and hope I get a reply, will report back here...

    What annoys me most is will it change again in a few months time......on past performance I think its almost certain ☹️

    Jan
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  • JVasek
    My C1 purchases were LE to SE to SE+5 to PRO (last October).

    I've had a reply from marketing and I am still not totally certain what my update entitlements are now. The reply just confirms that my 5SE update pack is converted to two updates of PRO. The purchase of the SE to PRO deal last October is not mentioned. But its confirmed that 3.6 and 3.7 will not count towards the updates so I still have two updates left once 3.7 is released.

    Jan
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  • David4
    from PO staff is exactly the attitude put forth toward their users. 2 policy changes to date and, I'm sure, more on the way.

    This is exactly the type of behaviour that gets companies sued.

    Add to this the fact that refund requests have not been honoured and instead have been put off until the release of 3.7 makes me wonder if the software division of PO isn't heading for bankruptcy protection. There's no reason not to give refunds to those who have asked. And, to make people wait until the release of 3.7 when the PO track record for hitting release dates is so appauling, is inexcuseable.

    The policy change for SE to Pro is simple wrong. PO is simple too arrogant to see it. They'll never get another penny of my money. Davidk
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  • Tim2
    Well DavidK what do you expect from a company like this. I doubt also that we will ever see our money back. I think when they put out the offer they never intended to honor it, I think they needed an influx of cash so made the 5 pack offer knowing they were going to cancel SE. They have lied and continue to lie to us and cheat us out of what was offered. I certainly hope someone starts a class action against them.
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  • NN88997121
    Yup, they knew what they were doing when they came out with SE. Bait and Switch! I also would like my money back.
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  • David4
    [quote="Larry Carter"] wrote:
    Yup, they knew what they were doing when they came out with SE. Bait and Switch! I also would like my money back.[/quote]

    Good luck. You might see your refund when 3.7 is out. Now... when is that again????? Davidk
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  • Tim2
    I don't see why we have to wait for our refunds either. They didn't wait to take our money and never gave us a thing for it. If I don't get every nickle back plus interest in my refund I will file a motion in small claims court. If I do get it back I will put my pro license up for sale though I doubt I will get much or anything for it.
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