.cos, .cop, .cof files not erased
As I delete a .CR2 file CO7 doesn´t delete the related .cos, .cop and .cof files...
Needless to say there´re thousands of them taking unnecessary space on my hard-drive, not much, but still !
Any reason for this behavior and how do I get rid of them except manually ? ...which is really not an option !
Needless to say there´re thousands of them taking unnecessary space on my hard-drive, not much, but still !
Any reason for this behavior and how do I get rid of them except manually ? ...which is really not an option !
0
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You could move your images to another folder, for example from the Capture Folder to the Select Folder. All residue can be removed from the Capture Folder. Next, you move your images back. 1 -
Sure I could...
But would be much nicer if CO did what it was supposed to...I mean, how hard can it be to delete those files once delete is clicked ? And another thing is that I´d have to go through hundreds of image folders, so thanks, but no thanks...
One would think that deleting all the files was the simplest of tasks for CO to do, but apparently it´s not...0 -
I agree, but I answered the second part of your post providing a workaround. 0 -
[quote="Paul_Steunebrink" wrote:
I agree, but I answered the second part of your post providing a workaround.
I know, and I thank you for that Paul...and we´ve talked about this same issue before. Merely to find a workaround I wanted to raise this matter on the open but I doubt anyone who´s in charge is reading this. Guess I should raise a support case but I can´t believe they didn´t know this already. CO6 had this same issue, looks like PO isn´t doing anything about it. Not the end of the world but so annoying and a silly bug !0 -
I have put it on my "bugs harvesting" to-do list to look into it (again) and contact Phase One if applicable. 0 -
Cool ! Let´s hope they take this seriously and get it solved... 0 -
Oh dear, whatever happened to Windows?
On my computer all these side files and folders are stored in folders all named 'CaptureOne'. I can search for all such folders on each disk and delete them all, one disk after another. About 10Gb in total.
Thank you for drawing this problem to my attention.
If you are at all unsure, clear (empty) the Recycle Bin first so that you can see what has been 'deleted' and restore from any mistake.
Peter0 -
...and by doing that I´d loose all the adjustments made to all the 4000+ images stored on my hard-drives... 0 -
Ooops! I didn't fully understand your problem. I process individual images in individual Windows folders. You must be doing some batch work. But do you not save part-processed images? Then you can safely jettison cos and cop? I can't recall ever revisiting Cap1 to reprocess an ex-Cap1 image - I've already moved on to CS5 for the final adjustments.
I think you are asking for Cap1 to delete all files associated with a cr2 file if/when you delete it. I don't do that. I just delete the Windows folder, then everything goes.
Are we making progress?
Best wishes, Peter0 -
There´s a bit of language barrier here (I´m finnish) so I don´t know if I fully understand your question, but this is the way I do it -
My folder structure is: year ---> month ---> date
After a photoshoot I import all files to the designated folder, delete all images I don´t like, make any necessary adjustments to those I keep...and that´s it. I´ve PS CS4 but don´t really use it.
And whenever I need a .jpg, .tiff I open CO and process the file...0 -
How are people performing the delete process?
I'm running 7.1.6 on Win 7 Pro and using sessions.
If I move the source image (Usually a CR2 in my case, perhaps a jpg sometimes) to the Capture One "Trash" Folder all the .cos, .cop, .cof files and the folder structure go with it. I have not specifically checked for the local adjustment files but assume they would go too. LCCs maybe not - they may have been used elsewhere.
If I then Empty the Trash (by right clicking in the Trash folder for the session and using the option that is available) everything disappears from the Trash.
So I'm guessing you are all using a direct delete in order to save a step or two and that is where the problem appears?
If you MOVE a source file to any Session Folder (e.g. a folder designated to be the Capture, Selects, Trash or even, presumably, Output folder I think the same principle applies. So one presumably safe method of tidying up orphaned .cos, etc., files, would be to select all the files in a folder that currently appear (and so presumably are files you want to keep at this time) and move them to another folder using the facility within C1 having set your new folder to be the current Selects folder for example.
Whatever is left behind in the Capture One folder within the original image folder (and the Cache and Settings 70 folders within there too) should be the orphaned files you want to delete.
In theory you could then just delete those folders through Windows. However I am conscious that that would not be likely to update the related cosession file. Whether this is a problem I am not sure. In theory I would hope that is would either be a non-problem because although the internal references to the Windows deleted files might still exist they would never be referenced so it would not be a big problem. If it was of concern then I guess the easy approach would be to ensure the Session fileders and structures are as you want them to be and then delete the cosession file and create a new session with the same "clean" folders. That should then complete the tidy up process.
As I recall Paul S has written up the steps to the session cleanup activity - hopefully he has the link available for a quite paste into this thread!
It may not be a solution that will be completed in a few minutes but if you really do feel the need to tidy up the orphaned files that already exist then it might be the most readily available way forward that offers some guarantee of the process steps being verified for the session as you step through the process.
HTH.
Grant0 -
Hello VKE
Your English is very good - better than my Chinese (my wife comes from China)!
Yes, we are making progress. But firstly let me compliment you on your photo website. I very much enjoyed looking through your artistic images. Clearly you are much busier than me, so this will affect the way you use Cap1.
I note Grant's input but I think he has jumped in at the deep end. I think the core issue is how you set up and use your file structure, then the delete routine should be relatively straightforward.
I do not use Sessions. I don't know why anyone does! The Cap1 user interface is frankly a nightmare to me - but each to his own.
I suspect your file system is similar to mine. You put all the images from one shoot in a date-named folder, presumably one you have created in Windows. You then access this folder in Cap1 and immediately Cap1 generates side files stored in a CaptureOne sub-folder with a Cache and Settings70 sub-folders. You then review the images in Cap1 and delete cr2 rejects. This immediately leaves behind orphaned side files. I don't think Cap1 is unique in not tidying up these loose ends. Do you (or Grant) know of any photo software that does this automatically?
So, we have the first delete issue. My initial reaction is to simply delete the CaptureOne folder and allow Cap1 to rebuild the review files from the cr2 files you have retained. Or, you can use the Windows 'Search' facility on your main date-named folder to find all unwanted side files and delete them yourself.
You then process the cr2 files you have retained and allow Cap1 to create and store side files, perhaps including part-processed variants? At this stage you may not go right through the process to an output tif. But you will return to the main date-named folder to review and complete the process. At which stage you may decide to delete one or two cr2 files.
This is the second delete issue. You want to delete all files associated with a cr2 file. You can do this by using Windows Search using the name of the cr2 file, and then check the Search list before deleting all the cr2-related files. I know this works. I have done it.
Now to the third delete issue. You would like to be able to go back, retrospectively, to clean up your hard drives by removing archived and orphaned Cap1 side-files. However you do this, it will be messy and time-consuming, I think. One way is to use a general Windows Search facility in the CaptureOne folder for each shoot. Then you can identify cos files, etc. that do NOT have a corresponding cr2 file and selectively delete as appropriate. This would work, and you can estimate the time it would take to treat all your archived shoots retrospectively.
I don't think I can comment much further. My initial workflow is similar to yours, I think. But I use different software. I create a date-named + Subject main folder (e.g. 14.02.28 London Trip) and copy my cr2 files into there using EOS (which also names each image in an on-going numerical sequence). I then browse the folder in Breeze Browser Pro. I flag 'keepers' and move them to a sub-folder I name 'BB Selected1'. Then I delete all cr2 rejects. Then I use BreezeBrowser to re-sift and select the best images. I save these images in a folder I name 'BB Selected2'.
I do NOT attempt to process these selected images in one folder. I select individual images (the 'very best' if you like) and for each one I create a processing folder that is simply named with the image number. Now I open Cap1 and set to work on each image folder. So each image ends up with a unique CaptureOne sub-folder and Cache/Settings70 sub-folders. I can delete these folders at will, in real-time or retrospectively.
This workflow puts me in charge, NOT Cap1!
I hope this rather long input is of use to you.
Peter0 -
[quote="Vesa Kalervo Ekholm" wrote:
Cool ! Let´s hope they take this seriously and get it solved...
Hi Vesa,
I ran some tests and have come to the conclusion that - in my setup - the issue existed as well, but... (drum role) has been solved in 7.2 (or perhaps earlier, not sure, does not matter).
To cut a long story short, with CO 7.2 all must work as it should be: when you delete an image from Capture One, the side car files are deleted (or moved to Trash) as well. Of course you can still find some residue as old sidecar files from earlier deleted images still reside on the disk.
I you have another experience, please let us know.0 -
Hi Paul !
Well I´ve a quite different kind of experience with 7.2
Yesterday I had a photoshoot...took 670 shots, saved 35 and deleted the rest as no good. Now there´s still 670 .cos and 1238 .cop/.cof files at Cache and Settings70 folders under CaptureOne.
So as I see it - nothing has changed...
But how ever it is, I´m not going to loose my good night sleep over this...I´m just not willing to accept that this not so inexpensive software can do amazing things to an image but can´t do the simplest task by deleting the unwanted files 🤓0 -
[quote="Peter" wrote:
Hello VKE
Your English is very good - better than my Chinese (my wife comes from China)!
Yes, we are making progress. But firstly let me compliment you on your photo website. I very much enjoyed looking through your artistic images. Clearly you are much busier than me, so this will affect the way you use Cap1.
I note Grant's input but I think he has jumped in at the deep end. I think the core issue is how you set up and use your file structure, then the delete routine should be relatively straightforward.
I do not use Sessions. I don't know why anyone does! The Cap1 user interface is frankly a nightmare to me - but each to his own.
I suspect your file system is similar to mine. You put all the images from one shoot in a date-named folder, presumably one you have created in Windows. You then access this folder in Cap1 and immediately Cap1 generates side files stored in a CaptureOne sub-folder with a Cache and Settings70 sub-folders. You then review the images in Cap1 and delete cr2 rejects. This immediately leaves behind orphaned side files. I don't think Cap1 is unique in not tidying up these loose ends. Do you (or Grant) know of any photo software that does this automatically?
So, we have the first delete issue. My initial reaction is to simply delete the CaptureOne folder and allow Cap1 to rebuild the review files from the cr2 files you have retained. Or, you can use the Windows 'Search' facility on your main date-named folder to find all unwanted side files and delete them yourself.
You then process the cr2 files you have retained and allow Cap1 to create and store side files, perhaps including part-processed variants? At this stage you may not go right through the process to an output tif. But you will return to the main date-named folder to review and complete the process. At which stage you may decide to delete one or two cr2 files.
This is the second delete issue. You want to delete all files associated with a cr2 file. You can do this by using Windows Search using the name of the cr2 file, and then check the Search list before deleting all the cr2-related files. I know this works. I have done it.
Now to the third delete issue. You would like to be able to go back, retrospectively, to clean up your hard drives by removing archived and orphaned Cap1 side-files. However you do this, it will be messy and time-consuming, I think. One way is to use a general Windows Search facility in the CaptureOne folder for each shoot. Then you can identify cos files, etc. that do NOT have a corresponding cr2 file and selectively delete as appropriate. This would work, and you can estimate the time it would take to treat all your archived shoots retrospectively.
I don't think I can comment much further. My initial workflow is similar to yours, I think. But I use different software. I create a date-named + Subject main folder (e.g. 14.02.28 London Trip) and copy my cr2 files into there using EOS (which also names each image in an on-going numerical sequence). I then browse the folder in Breeze Browser Pro. I flag 'keepers' and move them to a sub-folder I name 'BB Selected1'. Then I delete all cr2 rejects. Then I use BreezeBrowser to re-sift and select the best images. I save these images in a folder I name 'BB Selected2'.
I do NOT attempt to process these selected images in one folder. I select individual images (the 'very best' if you like) and for each one I create a processing folder that is simply named with the image number. Now I open Cap1 and set to work on each image folder. So each image ends up with a unique CaptureOne sub-folder and Cache/Settings70 sub-folders. I can delete these folders at will, in real-time or retrospectively.
This workflow puts me in charge, NOT Cap1!
I hope this rather long input is of use to you.
Peter
Peter,
Sounds like a lot of work and I really don't understand why you don't use sessions for it.
For what it is worth I abandoned LightRoom at V1.4 because the catalog stuff was annoying be intensely and I found an alternative program that gave me control. I checked out LR V3 but felt nothing for it.
Later I tried Capture One as well, starting with V5 to discover what was on offer. If was different but basically to and with with my other first choice program. V6 came out shortly afterwards and added some of the stuff that I missed - local adjustments for example, though not as fully as my previous favourite. However C1 offered improved performance for the sort of volume shoots I tend to do and with what was available seemed to cover 90% of my immediate post shoot needs to get some life back.
V7 took that a stage further in terms of performance but added the need to upgrade hardware and move to 64bit Windows. It also introduced catalogs. I may use that feature for a catalogue of completed images but I prefer the control that Sessions offer for the individual shoots and developing work for them.
I have to say, maybe a little tongue in cheek here, that my workflow compared to your multi applications marathon seems much simpler. I may have missed something.
I don't think I dived in at the deep end. VKE is an experienced C1 user so I would expect him to understand the concepts. Perhaps he has already tried them and found them less than satisfactory. I have no idea but it seemed to be worth making the suggestion.
Basically, as far as I can see within my system, if I use the recommended C1 approach - send the unloved files to the Trash bin and then, when appropriate, empty the bin - there seems to be no problem. If others see a different result we should be looking for the clues about what may be different at this stage.
If people have an historic problem to deal with - already orphaned files and no obvious way to ID and remove them easily - then my suggestion to sort of "invert" the trash folder process seems to be a way forwards. Obviously it's not ideal but it is one possible answer to a pre-existing challenge where the opportunity to "get it right" back from the start has already gone wrong. Why things have gone wrong does not matter by that time.
My thoughts for what hey are worth.
Grant0 -
Well as I see it - I want to keeps things as simple as possible and this is the way I´ve done it since 2005 when I bought my first CO license (if it´s not broken, don´t mess with it 😄 )
Good suggestions from everyone but at the end of the day, just workarounds that don´t solve the problem...
If I´d take just a few shots per photoshoot there wouldn´t be any problem but since volume shoot is my way to do it...the problem is obvious...
After a bit of thinking - I could make a permanent folder X to where I´d import all image files after a photshoot, delete the bad ones and only after that move the keepers to the designated folder (dd.mm.yy) That would make it easy to keep the hard-drive clean in the future. But still, there´re the few hundred previous folders to clean up...0 -
[quote="Vesa Kalervo Ekholm" wrote:
Well as I see it - I want to keeps things as simple as possible and this is the way I´ve done it since 2005 when I bought my first CO license (if it´s not broken, don´t mess with it 😄 )
Good suggestions from everyone but at the end of the day, just workarounds that don´t solve the problem...
If I´d take just a few shots per photoshoot there wouldn´t be any problem but since volume shoot is my way to do it...the problem is obvious...
After a bit of thinking - I could make a permanent folder X to where I´d import all image files after a photshoot, delete the bad ones and only after that move the keepers to the designated folder (dd.mm.yy) That would make it easy to keep the hard-drive clean in the future. But still, there´re the few hundred previous folders to clean up...
vke,
Surely that is just about exactly what C1 offers for a standard session?
OK you may need to play with the naming and so create a few folders along the way setting them to be the 'Selects' folder as you work with them but otherwise your description is almost identical to what a C1 session sets up when you create it.
I tend to shoot events with more then one camera. I create a new session for each event, usually, and for each memory card use I create a folder on import. I could do it differently but I find it easier to manage that way when dealing with multiple cards. These are also my initial day by day backups and are copied to an external drive - as a complete session if time allows.
What I probably should do then is filter the un-useful shots to the Trash folder and the better ones to the 'Selects' folder (on selects folder per imported folder ideally I guess) but in reality I tend to treat the import folders as final destinations and I don't delete much - just leave them with a low star rating. Then some keywording, some editing , some rating and then controlled Output to various folders under the output folder according to intent/size/content - whatever suits the need of the shoot.
I also have a few perpetual Sessions running - undefined long term projects for example, or lens testing. Or for gather small shoots of similar subject matter over time where a session for each small activity would be silly.
As far as I can tell there is no reason why a session structure cannot also support a loose catalog type concept, other than having everything embedded in a large central file. A single folder and its contents and edits can be referenced by several sessions. I don't think that would have any obvious purpose for me, at least not so far, but it might work for some people.
In my case I also have another editor that works in a fairly similar way to C1 in terms of source files and sidecars and can sit well alongside C1 in the same folder structure without each interfering with the other. Using the session folder structure means that when I back up a session (by copying the entire structure to another disk) the output from both editors will be backed up. (Copying to another disk would make cross-session sessions a little fragile of course - but then if one knows that it's not a great problem.)
My suggestion of moving to a Selects folder to help tidy up the old sessions was really meant specifically for that need. It makes sense too for the regular method of session operation but may not be entirely necessary unless working on an active shoot with a client where real time decisions are being made about their choice of images (the Selects) that you may wish to segregate from the total set you have created.
But I'm guessing you already know this so is it more a matter, as you have hinted, of not wanting to change a process that still works for you? If so I can fully understand that. It also means that you can treat your entire output in the same way without having to wonder in the futre where it was that you changed the way you operated!
Grant0 -
Hello Grant
We meet again.
Your criticism of what, for me, is a logical workflow that works every time to produce a simple input folder structure is just silly. Hopefully VKE will not be as dismissive as you.
These forums really are not as friendly and supportive as they should be. It is making me think twice about continuing to volunteer any further inputs.
Peter0 -
[quote="Peter" wrote:
Hello Grant
We meet again.
Your criticism of what, for me, is a logical workflow that works every time to produce a simple input folder structure is just silly. Hopefully VKE will not be as dismissive as you.
These forums really are not as friendly and supportive as they should be. It is making me think twice about continuing to volunteer any further inputs.
Peter
Peter,
What am I missing here?
You said:
"I note Grant's input but I think he has jumped in at the deep end. I think the core issue is how you set up and use your file structure, then the delete routine should be relatively straightforward.
I do not use Sessions. I don't know why anyone does! The Cap1 user interface is frankly a nightmare to me - but each to his own."
I tried to explain why I don't think I have jumped in at the deep end (if there is one) and how, prior to V7, sessions were the only option - no catalogues available and that that, amongst other reasons, is why people use them.
It took me a while to work out what sessions offered when I first paddled in at the shallow end after a year or two using an application with a similar but, dare I say it, even simpler file management concept. It was a few months before I began to realised what C1 really offered for those who wanted it. Your experience to date might be similar to how mine was back then? If so it would explain your second sentence as quoted above.
I read your description of how you upload, select and then organise files and firmly believe you could most likely do that just as well in Capture One alone. Using C1's delete to Trash and then Empty Trash, as I took some time to describe in my post, should avoid the orphaned files you have. Are you actually deleting using Windows rather than Capture One? I could not decide from the process description.
Where orphaned files already exist within the system, for whatever reason, there is potential for using C1 to move all the files that are to be retained to a new folder within the session and then delete the remaining (orphaned) contents of the old folder and its sub folders whilst retaining the most important aspects of the integrity of the cosession file. Not ideal perhaps - but then neither is trawling though a folder a file at a time (even if automated by a program or script) to achieve the same result. There are a few reasons why I say that but let's not go there now.
It does not matter to me at all if you think you have a perfect method for managing your files and wish to stick with it. That's fine. I'm sure you will find another way to resolve your orphaned file problem if you don't see the benefit of the Capture One approach as it is offered and as I attempted to describe.
For vke's purposes, since it seems he has a somewhat longer history with C1 and therefore perhaps a somewhat more widespread and complicated problem to resolve, I think the basic concept of working within C1 has merit - both for integrity and use of time. But that's up to him to decide just as it is up to you to decide on your approach to your problem.
Any suggestions I make may, of course, be worthless. But if someone feels the need to ask questions or make observations on a public forum and asks for alternative ideas on how to approach something one assumes they are actually seeking some suggestions that might help them find a direction - even if their personal preference is to follow entirely the opposite direction to the proposal(s) offered.
If you feel that responding, at some length, to your points is not being 'friendly' then so be it. This is Phase One's Capture One forum and as such I tend to keep any comments I make constrained to C1 so far as possible and certainly when discussing any perceived problems internal to C1. It seems to me to be the polite thing to do.
If someone is making a point here I would assume it relates to C1 and so, if I feel I might be able to offer anything, I will offer what seems to be a workable approach that is contained within C1. Obviously if you remain convinced that your existing process is superior that's absolutely fine. It does not matter to me at a personal level at all, other than I might feel I was unable to put my point across as clearly as I might have hoped.
There are plenty of other forums out there that one could join if one has an objective to pick fights and attempt to show superiority. I choose not to join them.
Anyway, good luck with finding a solution.
If you have a problem with failed file deletions in C1, even though using C1 functions are they are intended to be used, then it would probably be best to create a support case and work through the issues with the C1 support team directly.
For what it is worth let me reiterate that if I delete a source file to the Trash using my system all the usually relevant files specific to that source file are moved with it. If I then Empty the Trash all the files are deleted as expected. That seems a safe way to keep the system tidy and avoid extra administrative effort - so to me that makes it a sensible way to approach the requirement. If you do the same and it doesn't work for you then report it so that the technical support team can work out what is going wrong. That is what I would do and is the same advice that most regular poster in this forum would offer.
Regards,
Grant0 -
...let´s not start any fighting here...
After a little thinking, and like I mentioned before, for me the obvious solution was to make a permanent capture-folder to where import all images after a photoshoot, trash the ones I don´t like and after that I move the files to the designated folder for post processing... And yes, I feel stupid that I didn´t think of this before and on my own 🤭
And since I´ve always used sessions, next I open Media Pro, assign keywords and that´s it...
This is the simplest possible way to do it, using CO only and just one extra step in my workflow I´ve been using for 9 years...works for me and solves the matter in the future 😊 the past needs a bit elbow grease but what´s the hurry, all in good time...
I have to use windows only to remove all the residue in the Capture-folder from time to time, but I´m sure I can live with that 😊
I´m not going to raise a support case over this since there can´t be anything here PO doesn´t know already. CO6 did this too so it goes back a long way...0 -
vke,
I think we all have that same problem from time to time - so surrounded by trees that we cannot see the forest.
I know it's true in my own experience.
Sound like a good solution to your workflow needs.
Do you Trash everything that you don't immediately select to work on? If so the Capture Folder (Set up as a Tethered Session to get C1 to create it for you?) should be empty by the time you have completed you selections and distributed to the 'work' folder. (Or trash.)
If not my feeling is that deleting through C1 rather than Windows is preferable - it should keep the cosession file in good shape whereas I would assume that direct deletes in Win would have no administrative effect on the cosession file. That might not be a big deal for practical purposes but I guess keeping the file as clean and complete as possible has to be a wise thing to seek.
Have fun.
Grant0 -
Grant,
Yes, I trust in first impression so I do delete a file immediately if I don´t like it...but, empty the trash folder later when I´m sure I haven´t made any bad judgement, and all this is done through CO (I don´t shoot tethered - If I understood you correctly)
At the end of the day...I´m quite disappointed in my photography and the progress I´ve made...so it may not take long until I sell my equipment and licenses. No more problems after that 😄0 -
[quote="Vesa Kalervo Ekholm" wrote:
Grant,
Yes, I trust in first impression so I do delete a file immediately if I don´t like it...but, empty the trash folder later when I´m sure I haven´t made any bad judgement, and all this is done through CO (I don´t shoot tethered - If I understood you correctly)
At the end of the day...I´m quite disappointed in my photography and the progress I´ve made...so it may not take long until I sell my equipment and licenses. No more problems after that 😄
Selling all the equipment is certainly a personal solution to the problem. It would be a shame though - I rather like your work. I guess your personal opinion depends on where you think you want to be compared to where you think you are.
I agree with your first paragraph and that should be a safe option in terms of getting all related files cleaned up as part of the delete. In which case your future administrative load should be fine. At least that is what my testing has suggested for 7.1.6. Whether that has always been the case I am not sure. I have not noticed problems with earlier versions - but then I tend not to delete much either. My rationale is the storage is cheap and I see a lot of images that seem to gather positive comments but would have been something I would have rejected early in the process. So I wonder if one day I might find a way to make them works of art ... 😉
The 'Tethered' option is something I picked up from a comment on here a few months ago.
As I understand it the only real difference between creating a Tethered session or a non-tethered session is that with a tethered session a "Capture" folder is created. For a non-tethered "session" there is no Capture folder created.
So for your work flow, if I followed your description correctly, a Capture folder would be useful to have. You could transfer your files to that folder and then select the trash. The remaining files (or maybe just some of them to start with) would become "Selects". You could move the selects to the Selects folder and start work on them, renaming the folder at some point if you wished to (through C1 of course!). Or you could create a new folder within the session folders and name it to be whatever you want and setting it to be the Selects folder to take advantage of the "Move to Selects folder" feature.
I do much the same thing in effect but because I tend to shoot event and maybe 2 to 3 thousand images a day across 2 or more cameras I usually set up a non-tethered session and create a new folder for each card upload, naming it for day and camera at that point to make it easier to be sure that I have the day's images stored before re-using the card. As each folder will therefore likely have between 1000 and 2000 images I feel that is big enough for a single folder although with a suitable powerful machine the performance hit when using larger folders is not really that noticeable.
So, basically, I go straight to your second stage - the "Selected" folder. But that is not really a difference when working with a new session for each shoot.
Sometimes I create a session that is not shoot specific and add things to it over time. I suspect that is much closer to how you work. In my case, to keep things consistent, I still work with the same workflow creating and uploading to a new folder within the session for each camera and day combination. In fact each upload combination since C1 will, if allowed to, create a new folder for each upload named for the upload date and time.
C1 offers a lot of flexibility. Like you I prefer to find a solution within a single application if I can but I recognise that for some needs that may not be possible. However it is always worth reviewing what we do from time to time to see whether some things have changed in ways that now allow us to do what we want to do more easily or more effectively (or perhaps even both!) . I think it's great when this happens as the result of some posts in a forum like this one.
To return to the original headline problem for a moment ...
I don't think it is an issue for you or me at the moment BUT it occurs to me that there is absolutely no reason that I am aware of that would prevent a source image file being associated with multiple sessions and catalogues. (In the same way that it might also be a source file for multiple (non-destructive) editors!)
Now that makes things a little more complicated in terms of deleting a source file AND removing all associated files in a single activity. I think at that point, if I was to arrive there, I would have to accept that I may end up with orphaned files or that I need to investigate where else that image may have a relationship and take steps to tidy that up too. Presumably a specialised DAM application might know about multiple relationships and advise a user about them at the point of deletion?
These matters can become very complicated if we allow them to be.
Have fun,
Grant0 -
Yes, too complicated is correct. However I have submitted a Support Case to see what the experts can come up with.
Peter0 -
Hi
I would like to say that, to me, it is obvious that Capture One has to fully manage (creating/moving/deleting along with image files) its own side files. I have been very very annoyed with dozens of orphan files, at such a point that my son developped a small program for me, in order to clean my hard disks from them !
Now it's true that the problem seems to be solved with V7.2 (maybe with the previous version). I have just tested by drag'n dropping thumbnails to the session Trash folder (with SHIFT key pressed to move the images, else they are copied, not moved to the Trash folder) and also by clicking on the Trash icon, both methods work correctly (Windows 7 / 64 bits).
However, there is still a case in which the removal of side files does not work, maybe this is the cause of VKE's problem : when you open the folder for the first time, it takes several minutes for C1 to create all the needed side files (you can see the green progress bar in the Windows taskbar icon of your C1 session until it's finished). If you begin to delete images before this process is achieved, then their side files are left in the Settings70 and Proxies sub-folders.
So, I suggest VKE to give it a try : wait for the side files creation to be achieved for the whole image folder (check in the sub-folders if all side files are present) before beginning your work (don't do any modification) and then try to delete one or more images, normally you should see the side files disappear from the sub-folders.
My two cents, hoping that it helps... 😉0 -
Good observations from Epipactis.
The connection of the files in their various locations is, I believe, managed by references in the cosession database file. If this is still being updated as files are created or deletes attempted, etc. there is potential for things getting out of step or links not being written to the file before they need to change because of other actions.
I tend to use the import facility most often and that process, by the time it is complete, appears to have all the basic files written and cross indexed.
However sometime I will just open a folder of files in a session and work on them without importing first. If it's a large folder with a lot of files it may take some time to complete the creation of the basic files and so is likely safer to wait until that task is finished before doing much at all - especially deleting or moving!
BTW I don't think Move to Trash just copies a file from what I have seen. It moves it within the folder structure. But it does not place it in the System Trash folder.
Of course 'moving', in Windows terms, may simply mean changing a couple of flags on the file unless it is heading for a different drive or partition.
Grant.0 -
So, Gentlemen
With all due respect why are you not submitting Support Cases? And what has happened to VKE?
There is no doubt in my mind that Cap1 in 'Browse' mode does exactly what it is intended to do provided it is given time to do it - including deleting sidecar data. But in real life use it is easy to upset the UI system. So what is PhaseOne doing about it? How can they do anything without a few support cases?
Let's have a bit more professionalism all round.
Peter0 -
Please note that I am in correspondence with PhaseOne, Case Ref. 140115. They are doing a thorough job, but they need your input to understand exactly what the problems are. If you wish to assist in this way I suggest you create your own Support Cases and mention mine so that the same PhaseOne person can deal with them together.
So it's down to you! Thank you and good luck.
Peter0
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