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color profiles

bas1
I have been playing around with the color profiles a bit when processing the files. I usually use the adobeRGB, but now I have noticed a difference between the images when I use the "embed camera profile" option. In my camera I use the adobeRGB, so where does the difference come from?

Secondly, what is best to use to get the most accurate colours? I would think the camera profile, but is this correct?

Thanks,

Bas
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  • Paul Steunebrink
    Bas,
    You are mixing up a few things. Maybe you like to read something about color management. Phase One has a nice document on their web site to start with.


    First: the AdobeRGB/sRGB setting in the camera is not relevant for raw, only JPEG. So you are free to choose any output profile in CO4, independent of camera setting.

    Next: the camera profile is not what you set in your camera for JPEG, but an input profile that matches the color space native to the camera sensor. You select this profile in the Quick tools tab (it is automatically selected to the camera type).

    Finally a personal advice: sRGB is suitable if you do not have a color management workflow (= calibrated monitor, Photoshop CSx, proper printer profile). If you need output for screen display or web, sRGB is a must. Larger color spaces like AdobeRGB are not correctly interpreted on screen in many programs and operating systems (typically Windows up to XP). For AdobeRGB and Embed camera profile it is best to have a color managed setup.

    Note: in CO 4.0.1 is a bug in which Embed Camera Profile is not working properly; instead sRGB is applied.

    Hope this helps.
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  • thowi
    [quote="bigbird" wrote:
    ...

    Basically the camera profile is the "best", yes. The camera profile contains all the captures colors - no more no less.
    But it depends. A lot of captures does not contain all the colors of the cameras color space - many times sRGB is actually big enough.
    But the problem are not so much high saturated colors but deep colours esp. yellow/orange (brown) and blue that you even find in outside daylight situtations as for example landscape photography.
    These deep colors often get clipped in sRGB and even in AdobeRGB. Maybe you will not see this in prints, maybe you will. Depends.

    In general the best workflow is to leave files in their original color spaces (in this case the camera profiles) throughout processing to finally convert them to the device's working space just before output.
    An advantage is that there are no intermediate conversions that may cause a loss of information.

    Too, it's more "safe" to convert from the camera profile to any other color space in Photoshop as you have a color warning in Photoshop. So you have much more control. Don't forget that everything you see on your display is limited by your displays color space! And this one is definitely smaller as a camera profile.

    So from a standpoint of workflow with most accurate colors and quality it's the best to embed the camera profile.

    But there may be other priorities as for example workflow speed.
    If you shoot a lot images and just want to pass them from Capture One straight to a printer (or maybe a client want to have the files in a certain color space) you save time if you convert to destination color space in C1.
    Filesize may be an argument too as 16bit depth is a must for further editing (in Photoshop or elsewhere) of files that are bigger than sRGB.
    Last but not least: if you use anything else than sRGB you really should have a calibrated system and everything must be profiled in the right way. And you must have the know how to handle different color spaces.

    It's not that easy to find the best workflow for someone's particularly needs or demands.
    Me I adjust white balance and maybe do a slight correction of gradation in C1. But I never clip a color chanel to black or white in C1 as I want to preserve a safe range of all the colors in the histogram. Next I process to a 16bit Tif with the camera profile embeded.
    Afterwards I adjust everything in Photoshop an layers my preferred working space set as "softproof" with color warning. The original file rest "untouched" on the bottommost layer. This file goes to my archive. A copy of this file reduced on one layer will be the image I use for further editing (print version or what ever).
    As it is uncertain that future systems and/or software can read todays RAW files too this workflow saves a file that will be compatible even in the future... as long as we think about Tif as a less proprietary file format as the different current RAWs.

    A short note on the AdobeRGB set as color profile in the camera: as this just affects the camera JPEG this is a critical choice.
    If you don't adjust gradation and/or colors afterwards in Photoshop and send the files straight to a printer this might be okay (if the printer is able to handle AdobeRGB files).
    But if you adjust the JPEGs... you are working necessarily with 8bit data. And AdobeRGB much too big for 8bit. 8bit is fine for sRGB.

    Best Regards.
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