Upgrade Price
Hallo,
Last year the price was 99,- euros but this time it’s 119,- plus tax wich brings it up to ca 140,- euros.
Seems to me a little expensive.
Thomas
Last year the price was 99,- euros but this time it’s 119,- plus tax wich brings it up to ca 140,- euros.
Seems to me a little expensive.
Thomas
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While the upgrade price is moving towards the point that makes me look at alternatives, it wouldn't have put me off this year. What did put me off was the lack of meaningful new features for the inflated price. As such, for the first time C1 Pro 7, I'm giving it a miss.
We'll see what they do next year but in the mean time, I'll take a look at what the competitions doing. Personally, I don't see the point in complaining..... I just leave.0 -
well, regarding the new features, don't forget that updates will continue during year.
It is possible that they will come during this period within this version...and that's included in the price...0 -
[quote="NNN636372919529824193" wrote:
well, regarding the new features, don't forget that updates will continue during year.
It is possible that they will come during this period within this version...and that's included in the price...
Maybe... but unlikely. Previously, last few years, they've released new version with their new key features followed by updates to correct bugs, cameras & Lenses and performance. Anything new mid release is rarely that interesting. Normally (and rightly so) the focus is getting the best performance out of the existing software.
Strangely, pushing up the price could reduce income for them. Before I'd always upgrade even if the new features were of marginal interest but now, I'll just hang fire until a release comes up with something useful or, I've bought a new camera.
Mac OS isn't a problem. Apple supports their OS X for 3 years so I could stick with that on my main work computer and experiment with the others. Equipment, I normally upgrade cameras etc every 3 years so that fits in nicely timing wise. Basically, I could get away with only upgrading C1 Pro once every 3 years and avoid the 3 months or more bugs for each version release and have something stable (OS as well) for 3 years. Sounds more appealing the more I think about it.
Anyway, while I could easily afford to upgrade, I've chosen not to as I don't believe I'm getting value for money (at the price point/new features). I dropped Adobe Photoshop in favour of Affinity Photo as they provided software that does 99% of PS but at a lower purchase price and no subscription. I'm in it to make money and throwing money around unnecessarily seems wasteful and lacks business sense.
Bottom line, increase price too much and your regular annual upgraders will become once every 2-3 years upgraders.0 -
[quote="DAndison" wrote:
[quote="NNN636372919529824193" wrote:
well, regarding the new features, don't forget that updates will continue during year.
It is possible that they will come during this period within this version...and that's included in the price...
Maybe... but unlikely. Previously, last few years, they've released new version with their new key features followed by updates to correct bugs, cameras & Lenses and performance. Anything new mid release is rarely that interesting. Normally (and rightly so) the focus is getting the best performance out of the existing software.
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I noticed that too: v9 still had some very nice intermediate point updates like full color management in the viewer for tiff files, but v10 had virtually no intermediate updates that enhanced CO1, only support for their own MF back, or urgent bug fixes. I remember 9 or 10 weeks going by without any update at all. So they are saving it all up for the large version upgrades, and if that trend continues, then there is little more than bug fixes or OS update support to be expected.
On a side note: this may all start to sound like an expedition to put Phase One in a bad light, but at least from my side that is not at all my intention. I truly admire CO1 for the stellar Raw converter that it is, and it keeps getting better. Just not thousands of euros/dollars over the next ten years better, and that Ãs what it is beginning to look like. Perhaps they should re-introduce the light or express version that they abolished, to enable using CO1 at a reasonable price. But I think there is very little chance, it does not seem to be in line with what Phase One is about lately. And knowing them (however much they like to show themselves as communicative, with a unique support structure) they are not about to let us in on their future course...
Chris0 -
Chris, you may be right but looking at the reported changes under the hood for V11 - that's a lot of work for a one year period with several new camera releases and 4 notable OS updates to deal with (2 Mac, 2 Windows).
The under the hood changes have been necessary to address the continues performance perception issues that have need very significant for some users and not so much for others. I'm in the others camp on this but always happy to hear about enhancements.
The changes have also been necessary to make the Layers functionality changes possible and create a new baseline from which to progress. Sometimes you have to do this stuff because you just need to, sometime because you are forced to by outside influences (OS, development tools changes) and sometimes because you really want to add new stuff. (In line with constant customer demands to introduce new stuff ....)
I suspect that the last of those reasons has had to be a little suppressed for the past 12 months although there was still a lot of new functionality added. Let's see what happens from here on.
You might be right with you perspective but I'm always cautious about forecasting a trend line based on two observation points.
Grant0 -
Nobody wants to pay a lot for software because we're so used to having features, updates and even free programs. When we upgrade our phones, our cameras, laptops, monitors, storage devices etc we're all used to pay a lot of money to receive great items - but with software there's somehow a kind of lack of understanding when it comes to paying bills.
CaptureOne is a professional software just like Photoshop - and just like Photoshop its continuous development comes at a price for those who want to use it and stay up to date. Think about the pricetag for an upgrade for the pre-subscription CS-versions of Photoshop and other Adobe software. The CaptureOne upgrades are very reasonable compared to this and as others have stated for most people there's no need for an upgrade anyway.
For me the changes (especially layer opacity) have really made it worth it but if it's not worth it to you - wait for the next iteration. Before I upgrade I carefully read the new developments and changes compared to previous versions, then I decide whether it's time to upgrade or simply wait a year. Nothing will get worse by doing so, I've stayed on the same Lightroom and Photoshop version for many years without any issues until I made the switch to C1.
For most professionals upgrade costs of this "magnitude" really aren't a big deal, such expenses are tax deductible and they represent just a fraction of the cost of running your business whilst being one of the major aspects of it. And let's be honest, even for enthusiasts and dedicated hobbyists it's not an issue, it's really not that expensive when compared to your camera, your lenses, tripods and what not. And those are the things we upgrade on a more or less regular basis as well.0 -
[quote="C-M-B" wrote:
And those are the things we upgrade on a more or less regular basis as well.
A well considered post IMO.
Actually on this last point it occurs to me that the advancing software capabilities have perhaps led to me, for my purposes, NOT having to upgrade hardware as often as I might have expected to do.
Sure I would like to and I have endless calculations that attempt to justify the costs. But for my activities I don't really have to change so long a I can find new and improved ways to work with the files I can create.
I fully understand why very busy professionals might well have different criteria - but then they are probably not so concerned about the costs for the reasons you point out.
Grant0 -
Well we still have to pay for these things, even if they are tax deductible 😉
You're absolutely right, the necessity of hardware upgrades has decreased a lot due to advancements in software development and performance improvement. I bought my main workstation close to 9 years ago and it's still a capable computer and running CaptureOne just fine!
But I'm going to replace it this month with a new system because I'm working with bigger files and higher requirements from clients.0 -
[quote="C-M-B" wrote:
Well we still have to pay for these things, even if they are tax deductible 😉
You're absolutely right, the necessity of hardware upgrades has decreased a lot due to advancements in software development and performance improvement. I bought my main workstation close to 9 years ago and it's still a capable computer and running CaptureOne just fine!
But I'm going to replace it this month with a new system because I'm working with bigger files and higher requirements from clients.
Well, I know but as the world understands it money is no object in photography, right? 😉
Much of the time it's a fashion thing anyway ..... reputation demands that people keep up to date with the latest kit .... etc., etc.
It must be that way judging by the number of posts we see about support for newly announced cameras ....
🤓0 -
I am asking myself in which direction is Capture One going?
The Upgrade policy and the price increase are from my point of view, for Pros only. In addition the only complete new feature in C1 V11 is the annotation tool, which is also only for the Pros of interested.
What I’m missing is:
Luminosity masks. HDR and Panos applied on RAWs.
I see no reason to upgrade from V9. If I skip this upgrade too, I am out and I will not come back and pay for a full license.0 -
What about the new layer management? That includes the whole masks-do-over (including feather & refine), the application of styles to a layer, opacity options, clarity slection for layers,...
The new colour management engine (granted, that caused some issues but those are being dealt with)? The Duplicate-Checker, the LAB-readouts,...
There are a lot of new improvements that make it worth it.
If you're "still" on V9 you'll also get the improvements from V10 such as the improved sharpening tools, output proofing, camera focus tool module for tethered cameras, integration of tangent panels, optimization of JPEG output for size/quality, extended auto masking, better compressed raw and Fuji support, better Hardware acceleration, optimized LCC creation and lots of other stuff.
IMO the differences between v10 and v11 aren't as big but(!) between v9 and v11 it's huge and certainly worth the price. especially considering you'd be paying the same price as someone who upgrades from v10.0 -
I probably do not have any business posting to this thread. I have been using LR and PS since LR came out, and I have started to use C1 but only for the last 3 weeks. A real newbie. I have nothing bad to say about LR but...
My initial thoughts about C1 is that it is outstanding on what it does. I am keeping it. Sure LR/PS does more and lower cost but C1 has been refreshing. The quality is excellent, functions straight forward, and layers are great. I am not looking forward to $100 plus per year for upgrades (to start, I am not jumping into the $20 per month) but I do like it a lot.0 -
[quote="DAndison" wrote:
While the upgrade price is moving towards the point that makes me look at alternatives, it wouldn't have put me off this year. What did put me off was the lack of meaningful new features for the inflated price. As such, for the first time C1 Pro 7, I'm giving it a miss.
We'll see what they do next year but in the mean time, I'll take a look at what the competitions doing. Personally, I don't see the point in complaining..... I just leave.
Whether you think that new features are meaningful must be an individual matter. When v11 was announced my first thought was that there were more interesting new features than last time.
Ian0
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