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Local Adjustments question

Michael Sonshine
I have been processing some images with C1 that contain some annoying noise and, instead of just using the noise reduction controls I have been masking out the hummingbird to reduce the noise in the background area without losing the detail of the hummingbirds feathers. When I did so I noticed that I no longer can use the Color or Single Pixel controls in the noise reduction section or the Radius or Threshold adjustment in the Sharpening section.

Why is that? They are usable on the background layer but not on any adjustment layer.
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Comments

7 comments

Date Votes
  • BeO
    Top Commenter
    I don't know why this is but you are not doing anything wrong, it has been so ever since (ok, since v8, when I joined, don't know earlier versions 😊
    I found most of the time (if not ever) it didn't really limit me.
    cheers
    BeO
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  • Michael Sonshine
    [quote="BeO" wrote:

    I found most of the time (if not ever) it didn't really limit me.

    It is frustrating for me.

    I have been shooting with my long lens on a crop (instead of the FF) and, while the results are generally very nice, there is more noise than I expected. I really need the access to the color noise adjustment, but I don't want to blur my subject. Hence the local adjustments. But the inability to adjust for color noise and to adjust the sharpening radius has forced me to generate multiple variants, adjust each differently and then combine the layers. That works, of course, but so should the local adjustments. ☚ī¸
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  • BobRockefeller
    This must be a hard problem to solve. Lightroom's local adjustments don't allow sharpness radius or detail changes, nor anything other than a single noise slider.
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  • Michael Sonshine
    [quote="BobRockefeller" wrote:
    This must be a hard problem to solve. Lightroom's local adjustments don't allow sharpness radius or detail changes, nor anything other than a single noise slider.

    I don't disagree, but it seems a bit puzzling.

    I would think that the local Adjustment functionality would be implemented in a similar way to what someone might do it in a tool like Photoshop (or Affinity Photo) - that is, duplicate the image to allow me to do a full range of adjustments, create a mask on a separate layer and use it to filter the changes in the original duplicate. Bundle the duplicate and mask as a "virtual layer" and that seems like it should do it.

    I have designed and written enough software to know the the difficulty is truly in the implementation and I may well be missing something pretty basic, but it seems straight-forward. Of course I know nothing about the details of image adjustment and the formats.
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  • SFA
    Mike,

    It has been like that since layers were introduced.

    My guess is that C1 reinterprets from the source data/demosaic process for things like pixel controls and the design of that process is not going to work well with attempts to re-extract certain parts of the information via a flexible opacity variably feathered mask and then blend the result with the rest of the image's edits into something that looks acceptable.

    There might be some performance considerations too ....

    Tools that apply adjustments based "change to last level" rather than recalculation right from the base of the stack can get away with offering all adjustments as every level - but they leave you with the task of trying to make the transitions look presentable. Success rates, in my experience, vary depending on the standard expected and the amount of adjustments required.

    I over the years I have concluded that with certain subjects (bird feathers for example) on has to get an very good starting image if seeking a perfect result - especially for feather detail.


    Grant
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  • Michael Sonshine
    [quote="SFA" wrote:

    I over the years I have concluded that with certain subjects (bird feathers for example) on has to get an very good starting image if seeking a perfect result - especially for feather detail.

    I guess the best solution is probably to clone the original raw image, adjust one for noise and sharpen the other and then use some pixel editor to combine the two.

    It's not that there is a lot of work to do, but I have become so spoiled by C1 and its raw engine and tools that I had almost begun to think that I could solve all of my problems in it alone. This problem brought me back to the real world.
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  • SFA
    [quote="MikeFromMesa" wrote:
    [quote="SFA" wrote:

    I over the years I have concluded that with certain subjects (bird feathers for example) on has to get an very good starting image if seeking a perfect result - especially for feather detail.

    I guess the best solution is probably to clone the original raw image, adjust one for noise and sharpen the other and then use some pixel editor to combine the two.

    It's not that there is a lot of work to do, but I have become so spoiled by C1 and its raw engine and tools that I had almost begun to think that I could solve all of my problems in it alone. This problem brought me back to the real world.


    Two variants edited differently then processed to a TIFF file (or jpg if acceptable to you) and then merged in a PS like pixel editor would certainly be a sort of "industry standard" image blending approach.

    I am aware of quite a few people (not C1 users) for whom that approach is almost the standard approach for everything they do.



    Grant
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