Correct ICC profile for export
Hello. So I have been trying to understand the correct way to do colour management in C1 and in general, in particular to export photos for printing. I have an ICC profile for the printer paper and ink from the printing service I plan to use, and I'm trying to understand the correct method to soft proof and export these images.
As I understand it, I should select the printing ICC profile as the proof profile under View - Proof Profile in order to preview my images in the colour space available on the printed paper. I should then select a generic colour space such as Adobe RGB or sRGB under the process recipe, which is the ICC profile embedded in the TIFF file when i export it. Using a printer or paper ICC profile in the process recipe is not recommended, as it would then reduce the colour space of the exported file unnecessarily.
When I google the correct method to do this though, I find conflicting suggestions. Some youtube videos and forum comments recommend using the printing ICC profile for the process recipe, which allows it to be previewed when recipe proofing is turned on. (see an example on youtube here https://youtu.be/OKvYZZ1cFyE?t=374). However, there are also people who say the printing profile should be used only for proofing, and the process recipe profile should always be a generic one.
What is the correct way to do this? I do have a colour calibrated screen. Is the ICC profile selected in the process recipe actually embedded in the exported TIFF or JPEG files?
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I think you are misinterpreting that youtube video, which is quite good by the way.
He is creating those print recipes only so he can soft proof them by turning on the C1 Recipe Proofing tool.
He is not using them (I hope) when he actually exports his files.
He has selected a wide gamut profile in View - Proof Profile using proPhoto RGB.
He creates his paper ICC recipes plus the export recipes he needs.
He then turns on Recipe Proofing (Eye Glass Icon) and highlights his paper recipe to see how the screen image translates to paper.
For export he does not use the paper recipe but, I assume, selects a tiff recipe with an ICC profile his printing service will accept, probably adobe RGB. The exported tiff will contain that adobe RGB ICC profile which will then be translated via the printers software into their paper's ICC profile for printing.Certainly your printer could print with a paper ICC file from you but any sort of downgrading of color profiles limits possibilities if things change.
What if the printer has to tweak their profiles for a new batch of paper or ink. Your paper ICC would be wrong and need tweaking too. A file having a wide gamut ICC like adobe RGB would just get translated into the printer's new ICC.0 -
I think Cameron you have understood the important things, that is
(1) use the printer/paper profile for soft-proofing only,
(2) export always with a standard profile like sRGB, adobeRGB; which one depends on what's requested or offered by the printing service.
And yes, the recipe profile is embedded in the file when processing a recipe in C1. You can verify this by importing the exported jpg or tiff in C1 and look at the base characteristics tool, it should say icc profile "from file".
There are several ways how to set the soft-proofing profile in C1, see menu View>Proof Profile.
You either select the proofing profile for the viewer explicitly, or you choose "Selected Recipe" which is the default, which enables you to change the proofing profile quickly by selecting/highlighting a process recipe. If you have recipes defined with other than non-standard color spaces (e.g. with a printer profile), then by accident you can process a file with the printer profile by just having this recipe ticked, so special care is needed. You can avoid such accidential exports by not defining recipes with a printer profile.
If you have "Selected Recipe (default)", enabling the Recipe Proofing (Eye Glass Icon) is not needed to proof with the respective (selected) icc profile. In this case the recipe proofing enables you to proof all other settings of the recipe, e.g. Adjustments/Sharpening.
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Thanks for both the responses, makes it a bit clearer. I agree I must have misunderstood that video, as apart from that detail he makes a lot of good points that make sense.
Colour accuracy is definitely not as straightforward as I first thought, so its good to have some clear information on the subject.0 -
Relatively clear information on colour management basics:
https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/color-management1.htm
Colour "accuracy" is as hard to get as to catch a flying piece of soap under the shower, if something like accuracy really exists. If you do not control all aspects to 100%, including the viewing conditions of the print, it doesn't .
I think color management understanding and procedures are important, as well as some experience and trial and error, otherwise a satisfying print is merely non-repeatable luck (in case you ever get one).
And given you do everything correct, don't forget that in the end, for prints, it is the colour of the sunlight (time of day, weather etc.) or the spectral distribution of the lamp(s) in the room (or direct spotlights) and the color of the lighted walls which determines how you receive a printed photograph.
Hang a print on the wall and change lighting (daylight and evening lights, or change bulbs with different color temperature or CRI) and you know what I mean.
You should account the final destination of your print and its lighting in the image editing stage (e.g. white point of the monitor) and also accept some degree of variance from what you first intended, an/or make sufficient number of hard-proofs / test prints. If you have a defined light source for all your prints, e.g. your own gallery / home gallery, that would be best as you can control this important aspect too.
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