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Notice for users exporting DNGs from DxO PureRAW

Comments

27 comments

  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    I don't have DXO PureRaw but DXO Photolab.

    If I compensate the exposure in Photolab (+0.6) and export a NEF file three times:

    1) DNG export - Denoise and lens corrections only
    2) Tiff 16 (i.e. all corrections)
    2) DNG export - All corrections applied

    I get the following in C1:

    1) dark (like the NEF)
    2) brighter (representing +0.6 from DXO correctly)
    3) even brighter (too bright)

    If I import / develop them in Affinity Photo without any further adjustments then it matches what I see in DXO Photolab.

    1) dark (like the NEF)
    2) brighter (representing +0.6 from DXO correctly)
    3) same brightness as 2)   (representing +0.6 from DXO correctly)

    Hence I tend to think that it is due to C1.

    ________________________________________

    I created a bug report (#199614) but could not upload the DNG or TIFF file, not even the NEF file (uploaded under one minute):

    Error message: The upload took too long so connection was lost. 

    You really should prolong the connection timeout.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    Hi Jack-W, Is there any news? 

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  • Denis Huk
    Admin

    Hey BeO, not yet.
    Our support team should get back to you via the support ticket you submitted once they have any news.

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  • Xavier Noguera

    Hi

    I have the same problem with the dngs exported from DxO Pure Raw 3. I couldn't open a ticket as it asks me to upload the files but always fails.

    In the new version, Capture One Pro 16.3 performs worse than in the previous version. In this version the exposure difference is around 2/3 EV, 1/3 EV more than the previus version.

    My camera is a Fuji XT-3 and I use the curve Fujifilm Provia.

    Thanks

     

     

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  • Petr Vones

    I can't confirm the issue. PureRAW 3.6.2 (DeepPrime XD), CaptureOne 16.3 and Sony ARW files.

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  • BeO
    Top Commenter

    DNG export - Denoise and lens corrections only 

    or

    DNG export - All corrections applied ?
    (if there is such a thing in PureRAW as it is in Photolab)

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  • Xavier Noguera

    I use DeepPrime XD with vignetting, chromatic aberration and  lens distortion checked.

    I've opened a support ticket with a screenshot of the two photos open in C1. I couldn't upload the two photos because it gives an error.

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  • Sebastian Reiprich

    I just experienced a weird behaviour with JPG files that were exported from C1 out of DNG images that have been processed with PureRaw 3 before. When I tried to open those JPG files in Photoshop they were opened in the Camera RAW interface instead and had a slight color shift. I noticed that Camera RAW applied the Adobe Color profile to those images. Once I chose „Color“ (not Adobe Color, just Color) from the dropdown the colors turned back to normal and I did not have the option to choose Adobe Color anymore.
    I tried to uncheck the „other metadata“ option in my export recipes in C1 and that fixed the issue. The exported JPG files now open in Photoshop without any issues.

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  • Walter Rowe
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    Check your Adobe Camera Raw preferences to turn off opening JPG files in that app.

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  • Sebastian Reiprich

    As I said I already solved the issue for myself. It seems that Pure Raw writes something in the metadata that causes the issue. The problem is not that the JPG files open in Camera RAW, but the color shift. This happens also if you open the file in Lightroom for whatever reason. Because both applications treat the images differently than a regular JPG file and apply a color profile that is meant for RAW images only.
    This doesn’t happen when you export the images without the additional metadata information.

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  • Richard JOnes

    Is there any update on this issue, as Xavier Noguera stated, this is now requiring 2/3 EV increase in exposure on imported DXO dng files.

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  • Jack W
    Admin

    Richard JOnes From what I can see it is an incompatibility between DxO's and Capture One's image pipeline and the way DNGs are handled. It is not on the roadmap for a fix at this current time.

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  • Richard JOnes

    Thanks for the update Jack, that's disappointing but understandable.

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  • Jack W
    Admin

    Richard JOnes You're welcome. Happy to provide updates wherever possible. :) 

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  • Bryan Ray

    Is it just an EV change? There seems to be other changes to the histogram and colors as well.  I was hoping to get pure raw noise and sharpening effects but retain the beautiful C1 colors but it seems not so easy.  

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  • Gordon Macgregor

    Hi Jack W.

    This has been a constant problem with DXO 3.  All my Fuji files are returned considerably darker.  I have just upgraded today (25/06/2024) to DXO 4 and am running latest C1 and the problem still exists.  Is there any progress on this issue?

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  • Richard JOnes

    I honestly think capture one have no intention of fixing this, the DNG files from DXO open fine in all other raw editors I've tried, so it's definitely an issue with capture one.

    I've moved my workflow over to lightroom now, the files that DXO produce from my x-t5 are that good I started using pureraw for all my images, and having to mess about in capture one just to get them to a baseline standard was too much.
    I don't have to worry about lightroom's poor .raf processing, because DXO is doing that part.
    Another bonus is lightroom can add the Fuji film simulations to the DNG files, which capture one cannot.

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  • Gordon Macgregor

    Hi Richard,

    Given the elapsed time you may well be right.  Having previously used Lightroom and moved to C1 because of the poor Fuji file renditions, I have spent the last 4 years in the C1 ecosystem and am reluctant to change back.  Nevertheless you make a good point about the rendition of Fuji files in DXO, and like you, for all my better images I use DXO (particularly high ISO wildlife images), so I may well give Lightroom some consideration.  Thanks for your comment.

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  • Andrew Wallace

    I have just moved from Lightroom to C1 and encountered this problem. In my case I experienced both an exposure and colour shift. I have reported a bug (#239772) but I guess (based on this thread) that nothing much is happening to address this issue. In my case I had to increase exposure 2EV and remove a significant magenta and yellow colour shift. My test was with a file from a Fuji X-H2, and I am going to have another go with a file from my Canon R5.

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  • Walter Rowe
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    Andrew Wallace

    Are your files converted to DNG or are they camera native raw files? DNG derivatives made from camera native raw files can be troublesome in Capture One.

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  • Andrew Wallace

    Walter Rowe - the troublesome image is a DNG created by DXO PureRaw 3 from a source Fuji RAF file. I also see that there are problems with DNG files from DJI MIni 2 and Mini 4 drones which are original (exposure and white balance incorrect). And there is me thinking that DNG is an open standard that everyone could understand - silly me :)

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  • Walter Rowe
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    Just because Adobe publishes it doesn't mean everyone universally supports it. Also, the DNG files coming out of DxO are in reality linear RGB files (not true raw files). I believe this DxO incompatibility is a known issue.

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  • Gordon Macgregor

    I have to say Walter, that since Adobe is the defacto standard for advanced photo editing, I really think C1 should make every effort to support it.  Additionally, DXO itself has become a standard for those of us that take wildlife/bird photography, even more reason for C1 to resolve this.

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  • Walter Rowe
    Moderator
    Top Commenter

    Gordon Macgregor .. completely agree .. its up to Capture One to address it. I'm telling you what I have experienced over time. I have over 30K derivative DNG files that were made from camera native RAW files in Adobe Lightroom when DNG was the hot new thing. I regret ever doing that conversion.

    I think Adobe "normalizes" the raw data from sensor specific data as it converts the camera native raw file into its DNG RAW format. The camera native raw file provides sensor specific things like color channel gain etc. I think that makes the normalized Adobe derivative DNG not a true representation of the original raw data. It has been modified. I wonder if Capture One uses that sensor specific data in the camera original raw file in ways different from Adobe and explains why we get better output from Capture One than Adobe.

    FULL DISCLAIMER: This is my own theory based on reading the Adobe DNG specs and getting feedback from Capture One through support cases I have submitted. I am not an employee of Capture One. I am just a volunteer moderator here.

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  • Andrew Wallace

    In my recent experience, Capture One is the only software package that doesn't correctly display DNG files - I have seen problems in Capture One with files from both DXO PureRAW and those captured by DJI drones. I can open and view them normally with Adobe, DXO, Affinity Pro, FastRawViewer, and Windows OS software. As a new user, I am quite surprised that Capture One has issues - it is the last package that I thought would have problems. And as DXO is the best for noise reduction, so that will remain part of my workflow - I am just going to have to figure a workaround.

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  • Bryan Ray

    There are certainly complexities to conversion from RAW to DNG I don't understand, but I agree with Gordon Macgregor that it is surprising that Capture One would ignore how common and important this pass over to DXO for noise reduction and sharpening has become (especially for bird photographers, many of whom use the Nikon z8 (as I do) or z9). So you'd think if Capture One want people to continue using C1, they'd take notice of these exposure and color shift issues and help us address them. My workaround has been to pass the RAW file to DXO PureRAW first, and then work on the DNG for exposure and color in C1. 

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  • JF

    Walter Rowe - Also, the DNG files coming out of DxO are in reality linear RGB files (not true raw files). I believe this DxO incompatibility is a known issue.

    If DxO is doing noise reduction, then it can't possibly produce a true raw file, right?  Somewhat by definition, it's not RAW data any more.  It could still be 16-bit data, but processing has to be done to it to do the noise reduction and that processing doesn't result in RAW data.  DxO is indeed capable of producing linear DNGs (reference here) because a linear DNG is more RAW-like (maintains more editing headroom) than other ways it could have saved the image after its noise reduction (or other processing).

    But, there is a long history of Capture One not properly rendering/importing many different types of DNGs so probably what Capture One needs is just a more complete implementation of their DNG support that supports the whole spec, not just the minimum they think they can get away with.  If LR, DxO and Affinity Photo can all read the DNG, then Capture One should be able to also.  Otherwise, that just leaves Capture One as an non-interoperable program that doesn't play nice with other RAW tools (which it kind of is right now). 

    Other programs mentioned above such as FastRawViewer or Windows OS Software may just be rendering an included preview which isn't indicative of the type of full DNG support that Capture One would need to do its job.

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