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New License Model: Changes to the way licensing, updates, and upgrades work

Comments

1065 comments

  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    More than anything else this change appears to be a case of shrinkflation. While the price may remain the same, the value of the product has been reduced (i.e. the license does not include the same benefits as previously).

    If the new licensing model involves any benefits for users, it would seem that Capture One has done a very bad job of presenting these benefits as hardly anyone has been able to spot them.

    8
  • Dmitry Yaraev

    I have just one question. How can anyone buy your software if you can't even tell us how the upgrade terms will change in February? It's almost the same as selling something without telling people what it does.  Ah, I forgot you did exactly that just before version 22 was released.

    6
  • Weldon Thomson

    On the surface, it may seem there is very little difference between a subscription model, in which you receive updates as they are available, and buying software annually with each new version, so long as you get all the updates for your version until the new version comes out. It does not sound like the latter is what is going to happen. It sounds like, once you purchase a version, you are stuck with that version, and it’s stock feature set, until you can buy a new version or change to subscription. Many users, though, do not need every new feature. Whereas the product is sold as a raw processor, and the manufacturer knows full well that new camera models come out all the time, support for new camera models should be available to all, whether subscription or licensed for all versions of software. Under this new “scheme”, many users will more likely be forced to upgrade as they upgrade camera bodies or use new equipment. This is is wrong. One feature of capture one pro is its support for many different camera brands and models. I hate to give them ideas but what is next? why not different versions for different brands, or sell the raw support for different cameras by brand/model. Why do I need Canon and Nikon support if I only use Fuji? AGAIN, I’m not suggesting they do something this ridiculous, but why not if their ultimate goal is not the customer but, rather, fleecing customers for every nickle they can.

    9
  • EM

    CaptureOne had a great idea a few years ago. 

    A free Essential version for certain camera brands. Starting with Fujifilm and the X-Trans RAWs.

    That earned CaptureOne a lot of thanks and a good reputation in the photo community.

    Those who wanted more than the essential features could upgrade to the elite version at reasonable rates.

    It sounds like a fairy tale. But is not a fairy tale, but a, only 4 years old great idea.

    Today, 4 years ago, the fairy tale is over. 

    I was, many years earlier a satisfied user of CaptureOne and gladly bought over more than 10 years an annual upgrade at a reasonable price.

    In the future, this will probably also belong to the fairy tales of a great program for RAW development.

    I dreamed out. Money, money, money ...that's what CaptureOne woke me up with.

     

    @CaptureOne: the customers and users are the base of your business.

    Keep treating customers like today and in a few years CaptureOne itself will be a fairy tale!

    Too bad. But now I say goodbye. 

    7
  • pavel wohrizek

    Hello C1 - this is super disappointing - I bought the 23 licenses on presale, and not even 12 months from the date you are switching to no future upgrades !!!!!. NOT GOOD. 

    After 1st February 2023, new perpetual license purchases will not receive any feature updates (16.x)
    Why didn't you mention this when offering the upgrade?
    I bought the upgrade and expected one year of upgrades at least.

    I would request my money back since you made a super cool pre-order deal and now you have come out with this SCAM !!!
    No C1-Upgrade for me any more and no subscription.

    9
  • Bill

    The Capture One subreddit referred to it as CAPTURE NONE

     

    LOL

    6
  • Scott McCullough

    This is BS. The only real advantage you have over Adobe is the perpetual license. If you’re trying to force customers on to the subscription license, I’ll just get a subscription to Photoshop. It comes with Adobe Camera Raw which is essentially the same as Lightroom - a raw converter and a pixel editor for the same price. This is the road to ruin for C1. Please don’t do it.

    2
  • Phrank

    My biggest problem is, i don't like to be locked out of my Digital Asset Management system. I have a big big archive aka catalog. Once I stop having a subscription because I'm broke (like in the pandemic), or decide I don't need updates and new features for the moment, I can't access my photos inside Capture One. If it would be possible to be able to open the catalog whenever I want without these new features even if my subsciption has stopped, I wouldn't complain…

    Anyway, my Plan B is, to write all metadata to the files, or as XMP and being flexible. For sure I'll stay a bit at my just upgraded Capture One 23, but I will think about alternatives. "Avalanche" is a pretty good database converter…

    3
  • Kifleyesus Gaim

    I just purchased capture pro 23. I'm done supporting these scammers. The fact they don't even add lens and camera profiles after a new version comes out is a scam. I will just use Lightroom and Photoshop instead. I'm not even sure if it will work when I decide to upgrade my Mac os from Ventura to the newest one. 

    1
  • truepictures

    Maybe today is the chance to get a live answer from Capture One in Youtube? At 17.30 GMT you can ask David Grocer your questions about this in the chat ... and maybe we will get answers? The topic is "Gearing up for cold weather", quite appropriate I think, given the rough wind that Capture One is blowing towards the customer. Stay tuned :-)

    2
  • David Budd

    I think in the interest of Capture One and it’s boardroom that you reconsider making public exactly what the new Loyalty Program will be offering before January 31. Keeping it “secret” until February 1 is playing a “cat and mouse game” with your customer base that deserves to be better informed. It obvious from all the “internet chatter “ that this lack of detail has alienated many Capture One users. 

    Provide more transparency and you might just stem the flow of disgruntled users to the competition.

     

    1
  • Jack W
    Admin

    We won’t be keeping it a ‘secret’ until February 1st. We’ll make sure the details of the loyalty program are published far enough in advance so that you can make an informed choice, whatever it is you decide to do.

    0
  • Martin Stricker

    We won’t be keeping it a ‘secret’ until February 1st. We’ll make sure the details of the loyalty program are published far enough in advance so that you can make an informed choice, whatever it is you decide to do. 

    That's a good decision

    1
  • Richard in Maryland

    It hurt to leave Quicken when it became a subscription, but I did. It won't hurt as much to leave Capture One.

    0
  • J M Smith

    Well Jack, I am personally trialing other apps and like what I see.  I will indeed be moving on.  I have asked for a refund of the V23 upgrade and a rollback to my V22 license.  That is as far as I am going to go with C1.

    It would have been nice had CO communicated the "Loyalty Program" with this disastrous announcement.

    My first request for a refund was denied, but my credit card company was very sympathetic with regard to a charge back.  They saw it as purchasing a year of support and only getting 10 months, they were not amused. While I still would prefer to do this within the CO system, it is fine external as well.

    Hopefully I can still get V22 back up and running, but no great loss if not...

    0
  • truepictures

    Hi Jack D Williams,

    Give us a specific date! If the management does not know today what the loyalty programme will look like, that is a very weak performance. Does this also apply to the CO software? Do they not yet know what optimisations are coming?

    1
  • Jeffrey Kogler

    @Martin Stricker I also note "If you want to make sure that you get the latest version of Capture One Pro each year (as it works under the current model) and don’t need new features as soon as they are released, we want to make sure your cost of ownership does not go up."  I interpret that to mean if one purchases the new licence once a year the price will not exceed that of a current licence purchase (eg in my case it would be $AU508 less 33% at the time of writing).  (The price I see I beieve moves around a bit depending in the US/AU exchange rate).

    1
  • J M Smith

    So folks what is the consensus on the replacement for C1P?

    LR
    DxO
    Topaz
    On1
    Luminar
    RawTherapee
    Dark Table

    Other?

    For me I think it is going back to LR/PS...

    1
  • Shane Baker

    @JMSmith - So folks what is the consensus on the replacement for C1P?

    I need a DAM so LR seems likely - but I'm not happy about it.

     

    0
  • Martin Stricker

    @Jeffrey Kogler

    There are many more questions, e.g. what happens to the old licences, can I continue to use them? If so, that would even be an advantage over an upgrade model.

    1
  • Jeffrey Kogler

    Yes @Martin Stricker, I understand that you may continue to use your previously purchased "perpetual" licences.  However If you "upgrade" from a perpetual licence to a subscription that licence does not continue.

     

    0
  • Petri Wessman

    "So folks what is the consensus on the replacement for C1P?"

    I plan on evaluating DxO and On1, myself. And yeah, even just a cursory look reveals that C1 has priced itself totally out of the marketplace; the price hikes over the last 5 years have been utterly ridiculous, and C1 is no longer in any way worth the amount of cash they are asking for it (either sub or license). Competitors are offering much better bang-vs-buck alternatives, and many of them have permanent licenses (which is now effectively going away for C1 as a reasonable option).

    So I guess I should be thankful, this change by C1 helped me realize what a bad deal C1 has been with their modern pricing. They'd need to reduce their prices by at least 25% across the board to stay competitive, and since the current owners are intent on milking their customers for all they can (instead of building a sustainable business), that won't happen.

    5
  • Jeffrey Kogler

    @J M Smith, my plan is to wait and see.  Pricing and the structure of the loyalty program is key to the decision.  My preference from alternatives is likely to be ON1 Photo Raw.  I particularly like C1's user interface and particularly the flexible nature of its layout.  However I am not a professional photographer/editor and the price may become prohibitive (given that bit already stretches the budget).  I'm not sure about DxO's treatment of layers.

    2
  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    A Lr + Ps subscription is €11,89 a month.

    Capture One is €29 + the price of another application for adding/editing GPS metadata + the price of another application for handling larger catalogues / DAM, e.g. Photo Mechanic or Peakto.

    What, exactly, are the advantages of Capture One that justify this comparatively exorbitant price?

    . . .

    PS. To this comparison you need to add the frustration of dealing with Capture One's apparently understaffed customer support. Not to mention the long-standing software issues that aren't addressed.

    3
  • Stefan Sipl

    I think, DXO Photolab 6 will be my replacement for Capture One. 

    The only thing I have to find out by testing is how to deal with layers. 

    2
  • Stefan Sipl

    NIK Filters also integrate perfectly into DXO Photolab 6.

     

    2
  • SHS

    I will wait and see if the loyalty program will be ok for me. If not I'm looking at DxO Photolab + Nik Filters. I have no need for an integrated DAM (I'm using Photo Mechanic Plus). 

    3
  • Thomas Pietsch

    Please help me to understand why you can’t use the current license agreement to implement features more quickly?

    8
  • Thomas Kyhn
    Top Commenter

    Please help me to understand why you can’t use the current license agreement to implement features more quickly?

    Presumably because it would encourage them to save new features for major releases rather than introduce them when they're ready.

    But doing away with major releases does not necessitate taking away reduced upgrade prices. Nor does it require exorbitant prices.

    3
  • Martin Stricker

    Please help me to understand why you can’t use the current license agreement to implement features more quickly?

    I second this question

    1

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